R Model w/3208?

[Joseph Cummings]

On 5/12/2025 at 12:04 PM, tjc transport said:

A real slug even on flat ground

I drove a Louieville with one in it that was a "snooper truck" for going under bridges. 5x4 and a tandem. Here in Northeast Pa, and Northwest Pa is was really really slow

[Joey Mack]

I wonder if id like one in my C-30 ?? Nevermind the gearing..

[67RModel]

I posted this a while back in another thread:

Years ago at one of my first laboring jobs as a teenager we had one in a 1988 GMC Top Kick dump truck. 33,000 GVW with a 2 speed rear end. I couldn't drive it because it was a CDL truck but everyone who did abused the ever loving snot out of that truck/engine. Always overloaded. Under maintained and just down right abused. Some of the guys did it intentionally because the rest of the truck was just utter GM junk and they didn't like driving it. That thing never missed a beat. That engine would start and run no matter what. The company ended up selling it years later to a farmer who just wanted it for his property. The frame got bad rust jacking and nobody would pass the state inspection on it but it ran like a sewing machine when the guy took it away. That's my only experience with a 3208 but have always heard they were underpowered for their size (10.0L) and not "good" engines. 

 

My guess is if used and maintained properly they are probably as good as any other engine....

[tjc transport]

53 minutes ago, Joey Mack said:

I wonder if id like one in my C-30 ?? Nevermind the gearing..

problem with the 3208 in a pickup is going to be trying to keep a driveshaft in it. 

[Joey Mack]

I wondered that myself..

[Joey Mack]

Mine is a C-30 with a granny tranny, and 4:11 rear gears.

[Geoff Weeks]

1 hour ago, Joseph Cummings said:

Van Norman Purr-fect-O 944-S and 977-S have entered the chat, S stands for "Sucker Outer" made for in-chassis cylinder boring. "Purr because you are boring a Cat)

 

Some of these installs have to have access holes/plugs in the cab to get headbolt out, That would preclude any in chassie boring.

Portable boring is nice when there is room to work, and be sure it is set-up accurately, unfortunately, that is a rarity

[67RModel]

Probably a front spring upgrade too. I would think they are pretty heavy compared to a 350 or 454 gasser. 

[67RModel]

If I remember correctly they have a real nice distinct sound to them too. Maybe it was the muffler that was on the truck. But it sounded real nice and kinda mean. Like I said I never drove it but rode in it many times. From the passenger seat it seemed like it revved like a gasser. Almost like it had no flywheel on it. But you could also lug it down pretty hard and it would pull the weight.

[davehummell]

Back in the 70's I worked on quite a few 3208 I guess they were ok but it seemed like they were installed in trucks that needed more engine. when they brought out the d-3 and the 931loaders it was half of a 3208. I remember working on 1160's they were before the 3208's those old 1160's would clear the shop when they started up cold.  

[Joey Mack]

One of the fleet's i serviced had a Cat V-250 forklift with a fresh 3208.  It ran great and didnt struggle in that huge forklift.. I moved a lot of metal with that lift truck..  

[cruiseliner64]

3 hours ago, The Heinz said:

I love the sound of those EMD diesels, especially the 16-645 in the SD40-2 series. I do love the roots-blown motors too, sounds like a beefy tractor. 

Yeah,the sound of an EMD is something to behold.When I started driving there were still some old locos with 8V645s.We worked them in pairs and the sound of a pair in full cry was pure class....

Paul

[Joseph Cummings]

5 hours ago, Geoff Weeks said:

Some of these installs have to have access holes/plugs in the cab to get headbolt out, That would preclude any in chassie boring.

Portable boring is nice when there is room to work, and be sure it is set-up accurately, unfortunately, that is a rarity

Yeah it's great when you have room to work. Unfortunately that is not often anymore

[harrybarbon]

On 5/13/2025 at 6:56 AM, D-Day said:

Here is one of the Fords with a 3208 and little 13 speed it was also a dump truck it needs a new home if there are any Ford fans out there 

This model Louie with the 3208 Cat was widely used for concrete agitators and rigid tipper/dump trucks. The Cat was good for getting out of wet job sites compared to the V8 petrol powered Fords and Inters. The agi's usually carried 4.3 to 5 cubic meters of premix concrete, depending where they operated, so they would not get caught overloaded. with concrete spilled onto the roadway when they took off at lights or stopped position, meant the barrel was full, especially on a hilly road. Many concrete agi-owner drivers made a lot of money from theses Louie's, particularly those who took good care of their trucks, maintenance and driving style. Some are still in use by small contractors that have a Bobcat and tipper operation.

[66dc75]

Had 2 3208s one in an L8000 and one in a f8000 4 speed allisons both boom trucks. Swapped in a RT910 into the Louisville which gave me something to do while waiting to get up to speed. Man were they slow. Didn't matter how cold it was I would just bump the starter and it was running. Neither one ever let me down though.

[1961H67]

I work for Carolina Tractor in the early 80s ( Cat Dealer) and worked on a bunch of trucks with 3208s mostly Fords, they put a lot in those Budd cab trucks, Fords & Mack’s , the first ones I remember where painted blue with a inline injection pump and were called 1160s . A couple local fire trucks had the cab over Fords ( Budd cab ) with turbos , they were really spunky, ok for a fire truck, at least it wasn’t like my local fire department, they had a Maxforcre Navistar and it would go into limp mode on the way to a fire,, Not Good!!  Like every one says, if you have a piston problem it had to be bored 

 

[kscarbel2]

On 5/12/2025 at 7:16 AM, Jeff M said:

 A post just came across my Facebook page that shows a 79 R Model with a 3208 Cat.  The poster says it was his dad's truck and that it also had a 13 speed, which I imagine was that 10 speed version with 3 speed deep reduction.  I never knew that Mack ever offered that engine in any of their models, but then again there's a lot I don't know.  Perhaps it was offered as a bargain-basement option for the most frugal customers.  Or perhaps this was an online spoof.   Attached is a pic of the truck.  What say you folks?

RD492SX

[BOBWhite]

3208s are really nice in busses and RVs. Had a turbo/aftercooled one in a bluebird Wanderlodge that was great! lots of power. 

I think the 3208 got such a bad reputation not for being bad engine, but for what they were put into. Before the 5.9 and 6.7 Cummins that was really your only option if you wanted something compact. Lots and lots of Ag equipment got 3208s, they were beaten up then parked usually due to the machine falling apart around the engine. 

[BOBWhite]

On 5/13/2025 at 8:08 AM, cruiseliner64 said:

Cant say I ever seen one of these engines.In fact CAT sold very few engines over here apart from in their own machines.Foden  ERF and Dennison trucks plus all the American trucks were offer with Cat engines and apart from the US makes very few CATs were sold.In fact I believe although offered Dennison never sold a CAT powered truck.Although a great engine they were regarded as a premium product and few would pay the asking price when Cummins Gardener and Rolls Royce offered great engines much cheaper....

Paul

Did you ever drive something with a Gardener engine? I've alway thought those engines were really neat, wish I could get my hands on one just to look at it 

Edited 15 hours ago by BOBWhite

[Geoff Weeks]

7 hours ago, BOBWhite said:

Did you ever drive something with a Gardener engine? I've alway thought those engines were really neat, wish I could get my hands on one just to look at it 

I worked on a fleet of 6LXB's. I drove a bus from Columbus, OH to Chicago with one.  They are a work of art. Their main drawback is they are large for low power output. Low rev'ing but sips fuel.

Great engines in the correct application.

[Geoff Weeks]

9 hours ago, BOBWhite said:

I think the 3208 got such a bad reputation not for being bad engine, but for what they were put into. Before the 5.9 and 6.7 Cummins that was really your only option if you wanted something compact. Lots and lots of Ag equipment got 3208s, they were beaten up then parked usually due to the machine falling apart around the engine. 

For the same (aprox) displacement you could have a Cummins L-10 or a Cat 3306  and have a far better engine.

Both of those would pull a loaded semi at 80K.

Longer and taller but better suited.

If you look at comparing to a 5.9 or 6.7, you are comparing to a much smaller engine, in the case of the 5.9 almost 1/2 the displacement.

The 3208 was 10.4L

[cruiseliner64]

10 hours ago, BOBWhite said:

Did you ever drive something with a Gardener engine? I've alway thought those engines were really neat, wish I could get my hands on one just to look at it 

Yes I did drive Gardener powered trucks.A Dennison with an 8LXB and an ERF with a 6LXB.The ERF was a little underpowered but the Dennison was right on the money.Coupled to a 13 speed Fuller the Dennison pulled like a train and went like hell.Maximum torque came up at 975 rpm and stayed untill 1800 rpm.The slow reving nature of the Gardener matched the Fuller perfectly and was a joy to drive.All Gardener engine crankshafts were vertically and horizontailly braced and bottom end failures were almost unheard of.However Gardener were stuck in their ways and stedfastly refused to turbocharge their engines.It wasnt untill the business was sold to the Hawker Siddley group that turbo Gardeners became availible.It was too late,they had lost to much market share.Renowned for long life and as GW said sipping fuel it is well reported that more than half of gardeners ever made are still in service.A work of art to look at,I too would love to have one just to take to shows.The Skipper of a fishing trawler I once serviced told me he would not go to sea in anything but a Gardener engined boat.I will now tell a story which most would not believe and I would find hard to believe but I was there I saw this...One frosty morning I was asked to go to a saw mill were a Gardener engined  hyd.power pack would not start.I got there and was shown to the engine.I quickly found the battery was finnished and fitted a new one.The engine started first push of the button and I checked it was charging.With all being good I just had to ask where is the rad??? With out blinking the owner said it never had one.I was amazed as he explained the 6LX ran from morning untill night for 16 years at about 450 rpm and never had a rad.I stood watching it tick away and shaking my head wondering how just how is that possible......Hard to believe but I can swear on all my loved ones lives its true....

Paul

[Geoff Weeks]

Sorry if this seam "nit-picky" but it is Gardner, not Gardener, And yes, the mains are bolted up from the bottom and then a stud is run all the way across the block through the main cap, to hold the bottom end tight.

No internal oil passages with the exception of of the drillings between the main and rod journals in the crank. The crank is lubed with an oil pipe running down the center of the crankcase.

The engine can be broken into three sections: Crankcase, block and head, you can pull it apart with the block and head as a unit, or with the block and crankcase as a unit.

The injection pump was special to Gardner, the pumping elements were made either by Simms, or CAV, and you could lock off individual cyl while it was running, or "pop"test the injector without doing anything but pulling the manual handle on the pump. 

When idling in the cold of a Chicago winter, we would lock off 3 cyl and idle on the other three.    

Edited 1 hour ago by Geoff Weeks