bulldogboy

This discussion reminds me of a similar issue in the fire apparatus field forty years ago. In the mid 1970s a new company named Emergency One opened in Ocala, FL to build fire apparatus with aluminum bodies on commercial chassis. At the time the major apparatus builders were using steel bodies which rusted out in no time but that didn't stop them from putting down aluminum with the usual arguments; made out of old beer cans, will melt at its first fire, etc. However, E-Ones soon were accepted by many fire departments and the Ford "C"/E-One pumper became a workhorse of many fire departments including big cities such as Boston, Chicago, Indianapolis, etc. Later, E-One started to build their own chassis with aluminum cabs; these "Typhoon" and "Cyclone" cabs are still being built today and are still popular with big city fire departments. If aluminum is tough enough to meet the requirements of active fire departments it says a lot about aluminum's durability. E-One soon became one of the largest fire apparatus builders in the U.S.A. The next big step for E-One was building aerial ladders out of aluminum. Prior to this ladders were made of wood (the old days) or steel. Like the bodies, aluminum aerial ladders performed well, were lighter weight, and did not melt when exposed to fire. Again, the aerials were popular in big cities especially because, with their lighter weight, they could use shorter jacks and not the large outriggers needed by steel ladders to stabilize them. In a city like Boston with narrow, car choked streets this is an important feature. It's interesting that E-One's biggest competitor, who built aerial ladders out of steel and put down aluminum, soon saw the writing on the wall and realized that if they wanted to compete they, too, had to offer aluminum as an option for aerial ladders. Boston tried these ladders but they always go back to E-One because of operational requirements and durability. And what happened to those other apparatus builders of the 1970s? Well, American LaFrance, Pirsch, and Ward LaFrance are out of business, Mack got out of the fire apparatus business (Bummer!!), and Seagrave is still hanging in there. The steel vs. aluminum argument may continue in the pickup world but, over the last forty years, aluminum has proved its durability in the demanding world of firefighting. bulldogboy

Those three Ahrens-Fox fire engines bring back memories; when I was a kid there was a fire station in my town that had similar A-F trucks in it. There was a pumper, a hose truck, and a city service ladder truck. I must be getting old if I remember the Ahrens-Foxes when they were in service but they were impressive rigs. bulldogboy

These are two brochures that I have on Mack fire chassis and the "R" model pumper. The chassis brochure covers the "MS", "MC", "R", and "CF" chassis that were available to other fire truck manufacturers. To quote the brochure, "Mack fire chassis are available as custom-built or commercial. Each and every model has been thoroughly engineered to meet the stringent specifications of the fire service. What's important to note is that Mack chassis are manufactured to all NFPA requirements as standard, built in features." Also, "Look for the letters "FC" after the model number in your truck as your assurance of a Mack fire chassis". Hope that this helps. bulldogboy

Here is one Arizona fire department that has a website with its current and former apparatus. It is the Houston Mesa Fire Department just outside of Payson, AZ., www.houstonmesafire.org. Its first engine was a 1958 Mack "B-85F" with a deluxe cab that was purchased from a department near Pittsburgh, PA. While it is not the engine you are looking for it is a nice looking "B" model. bulldogboy

Looks like Morning Sun Fire Department's Mack "MS"/Smeal engine and crew has everything under control at the accident scene. bulldogboy

Westport, MA is a coastal community located between Cape Cod and Providence, RI. In 1931 the Westport Fire Department wrote specs for a new engine that included a 1,000 gallon booster tank, a large tank for that era. The only bidder was Mack Trucks but Mack engineers told the chief that, most likely, the chassis would not be able to handle 1,000 gallons. Undaunted, the department went ahead with their plans and, not only was the pumper/tanker successful, Mack used it as a prototype for future fire engines. The reliable Mack went on to serve the department for 32 years. In 2006, the department repurchased the Mack after it had sat in a field for 40 years with the intention of restoring it. I hadn't heard or read any updates until recently when I was reading the Westport website and they reported that the damage to the truck over the 40 years outside was too great so they took some parts off and sold the rest. The website has the model number as "6BC631019". No doubt this engine proved that rugged Mack chassis could handle the heavy loads and in 1935 Mack delivered a 750/2500 pumper/tanker on a "BQ" chassis to the town of Lake, WI. This "Type 95" is now in a museum in Wisconsin. bulldogboy

That would look good painted red, white, and blue with Patriot's logos on it. It would make a great tailgating rig, especially when you're stuck in a Gillette parking lot for hours after the game. RPI does have a football team, they play in the Liberty League. bulldogboy

It has a "B-95" emblem on the hood, a "B-95F". bulldogboy

Mack58B42: Look at www.chestertownfiredept.com, then "photo gallery". Scroll down to "misc older photos", the "B" and "C" photos are there. Also, a color picture of the "B" is under "fire engines". The first three Mack fire engines with diesel engines were delivered to Hamilton, Bermuda in 1960. There were two "B125F" pumpers and one hose truck. The pumpers had front suctions on the right side. The pumpers were "B125F1041/1042. I saw one of the pumpers still in service in 1979. Got to get back there some day!! St. George, Bermuda Fire Brigade had a 1960 Mack "N85F" pumper. After the departments merged into one island wide fire department, I don't know what happened to the "N" model. St George's website had a photo but the site is gone. bulldogboy

Nice looking truck; the "B" model is my favorite fire truck model. I had the good fortune to operate a couple of "B-85F" and "B-95F" pumpers back in the day, the cabs were a bit cramped inside but they were great trucks. Your truck is from Chestertown NY, its website has a couple of historic photos of the "B" model being delivered and also a couple of photos of a Mack "C" model pumper. bulldogboy

Semi-cab Ford "C" models were rare; that was about the time that manufacturers and fire departments were getting away from open and semi-cab trucks. There was one Mack "N" model fire truck with a semi-cab, the only Mack "N" model ladder truck built, delivered to Marcus Hook, PA in 1962. It had a 750 GPM pump and a 75' Maxim ladder. Unfortunately, in the early '80s the Mack cab was replaced with an IHC "Cargostar" cab. fxfymn: How's the 1925 'AB' fire truck coming along? bulldogboy

I've posted this on another thread; the photo is Alexandria, NH's former Mack "B-95F" pumper. The photo was taken around 1998 when Alexandria replaced this engine with a 1998 IHC/Valley pumper/tanker. The chief at the time said that they would liked to have kept the Mack but needed the FWD due to its all wheel drive capability. Alexandria is the second largest community in land area in New Hampshire and is very rural and hilly. Alexandria Volunteer Fire Department photo. bulldogboy

Red Horse: Was that "nameless" Cape fire truck a chrome yellow "R" model? bulldogboy

The Mack "N" model shared the Budd cab with the Ford "C" model. Perhaps this is how Mack will get back in the medium business, share the "F" series cab. bulldogboy

Joe: There is a nice "F" model tanker in Lorida, FL near Sebring, I think that it once belonged to West Sebring, FL. If you bid on the Pennington truck you could use the Lorida truck as a model. Or, you could keep it as a rescue truck, maybe as a regional rescue team with other departments in your area. bulldogboy

Winchester, NH Fire Department also had a Mack "A" model fire truck, Engine 6. I don't know if they still have that one. bulldogboy

Bolton, MA Engine 5, 1981 Mack "R"/Moody, 500/2100. Edward G. Moody and Son of Nashua, NH was a builder of oil tankers primarily but they also built quite a few fire trucks, mostly tankers. They went out of business in the early '80s so Bolton's truck is probably one of the few Moodys still in service. Bolton had a fleet of Macks at one time: a 1969 Mack "R" pumper, a 1975 "MB", 1000/750 pumper, and a 1945 Type "45" pumper. Back in the early '70s there were a lot of musters in the Nashoba valley and I remember the Bolton team's shirts had a picture of the '45 on them. I go down I-495 quite a bit, going through Bolton. occasionally stopping at the convenience store at Exit 27. Red Horse, thanks for the photos. bulldogboy

There used to be a similar "MC" wrecker/fire truck stationed at the rest area on the Chesapeake Bay Bridge Tunnel in MD/VA. It may still be there, I haven't been down that way in ten years. I also drove an "MB" fire truck, a bare bones, shaky, little thing. bulldogboy

Nashua, NH Fire Department, CFR-1, 2008 Ford F-550/CET, 500 gallons AFFF/ATC. bulldogboy

Nashua, NH Fire Department's Engine 8 and Engine 9 in 1977. Engine 9 - 1947 Mack "L95F", 1000/200 Engine 8 - 1962 Mack "B95F", 1000/500 bulldogboy

Red Horse: Just my two cents on these topics: 1. The way I understand it is that the Homeland Security Grants were originally intended for areas that were most prone to terrorist attacks after 9/11. But, as these things usually turn out, other places wanted their share too so the program was extended to everybody. I know of small towns in the middle of no place that received money for fire tankers and other gear not related to security threats. They have become Assistance to Firefighter grants. 2. Mini-pumpers have their place and, like every other tool, should be used as intended. In New Hampshire they are used in smaller communities as first run vehicles for EMS and to access narrow country roads and long, winding driveways. There are some really nice units around but they are not intended to replace full size pumpers. 3. Boston EMS has long used ambulances mounted on GMC 5500 chassis but when GMC got out of the medium business, Boston switched to IHC "TerraStar" chassis. Interestingly, Boston recently ordered 12 new Braun ambulances to be mounted on Ford F-450 chassis. 4. Interesting little uproar in Springfield Township, OH, home to the Navistar manufacturing plant. Seems that the local fire department ordered a new ambulance to be built on a Dodge chassis rather than an IHC chassis. Navistar is not too pleased and made it known that the Dodge is built in Mexico. 5. Do you have any pictures of your town's R-600 pumper? 6. Why does this type out double spaced? Takes up more room than necessary. bulldogboy

I like that Kingsport ladder; I also saw that "U" model badge on the cab. I wonder what was in that space on the bumper on the Columbus "CF" tractor? Looks like something was removed, a compartment of some sort? Kind of a different location for that light bar on the tractor. bulldogboy

Wow, that will give the safety guys a lot of sleepless nights. I always thought it unusual that some fire trucks carried a spare tire, I've seen pictures of FDNY Mack "Type 21" models with a spare tire. Did they expect the guys to stop on the side of Broadway and change their own tire? I can see me with one of my department's Mack "L" models trying to change a tire by myself (one man crew); thank goodness for the department mechanics. bulldogboy

Looks like they had a few "C" model fire cabs also. bulldogboy

This old Buffalo Springfield roller is sitting outside of the Pepperell, MA Highway Department. bulldogboy