New Mack Logo

[kscarbel]

This argument is really about the good old days vs todays technology. The old trucks had a simple ruggedness to them that will never be duplicated. They also had there problems. Rough ride small cabs coffin sleepers no engine brakes or very effective ones. Todays trucks have solved those problems but have there new sets of issues government mandates are most of the problems so modern trucks have lost the character of the old trucks. Mack lost alot of sales when they got out of the business of making a modern classic. I blame Renault for this not Volvo. Volvo has actually made better looking macks than Renault let them have. Example chu rawhide and titan.

You can blame Renault if you like, however you are entirely wrong. The MH and CH were being designed far earlier than the time frame you are imagining. And I'm very proud of both the MH and CH. We moved forward a generation in heavy truck design.

My thoughts are certainly NOT about old versus new. And I don't believe anyone is "living in the past". Speaking for myself, I'm in the global market selling cutting edge Euro-6 trucks every day. Thus I speak knowing the past and present, and with inside knowledge of the future.

[james j neiweem]

Really when you get right down to it Mack management couldn't lead mack through the tough times.

Thus the infusion of Signal money, Renault money and finnally Volvo money. I don't like Paccar

but they have proven that they can run an efficient organization even when times have been tough.

If Mack management had the management team that Paccar has had there would still be a thriving independent Mack. The same could be said for the White Motor company.

[kscarbel]

First off, if you saw my last post, we do have one Mack highway tractor.

And that is only one dealer, if I was in another region it would be a different outcome.

On our last two purchases we saved over 12 grand each truck. Would you pass that up with fuel working out to $5.90/gallon up here?

I guess the moral here is you can never change the one-sided mind. So go on bad mouthing Volvo and saying how much you all hate Mack now, and we'll see what they do in a couple more years. Then Barry can change the site name to Old Mack Trucks when the new ones are dead and gone.

I'll stop posting about it now because clearly there are so many people that have the knowledge and finances here to take control of Mack and make it the most successful company out there. So have at it.

Relax. If you read my post, you'll see that I stated you have one Mack.

My point is, you said that we must support Volvo and Mack. And yet you don't. It's a bit hypocritical. Why didn't you spend the extra 12 grand on a Mack in support of Volvo?

I have never "bad mouthed" Volvo. While far from perfect, I'm a higher caliber person than that. What I have done, in a civilized manner, is express what is called "constructive criticism". And, I am one to call a spade a spade.

Nor do I have a one-sided mind. I have posted that Volvo today makes an acceptable truck and engine (although not in the same league as a Scania, MAN or Mercedes-Benz). I simply don't want Volvo to own America's most iconic truckmaker, Mack Trucks, particularly because of what they've done to it.

[kscarbel]

Really when you get right down to it Mack management couldn't lead mack through the tough times.

Thus the infusion of Signal money, Renault money and finnally Volvo money. I don't like Paccar

but they have proven that they can run an efficient organization even when times have been tough.

If Mack management had the management team that Paccar has had there would still be a thriving independent Mack. The same could be said for the White Motor company.

Paccar has had 74 consecutive years of profitability. An American truckmaker impresses.

Paccar's feat is nearly tied by Scania with 72 consecutive years of profitability.

Nobody else even comes close to the financial performance of Paccar and Scania.

True leaders are certainly required for success. Mack Trucks had many including Alfred Brosseau, Zenon C.R. Hansen, Henry Nave, Al Pelletier, John Curcio and Elios Pascual. However Mack also had unqualified leaders (Ralph Reins) and ultimately a traitor that actually put Mack Trucks into the hands of Volvo (Marc Gustafson).

http://www.bigmacktrucks.com/index.php?/topic/26800-volvo-and-mack-kind-of-the-admirer-owning-the-idol/page-3

[41180]

[quote name="kscarbel" post="237009" timestamp="139463089

You can blame Renault if you like, however you are entirely wrong. The MH and CH were being designed far earlier than the time frame you are imagining. And I'm very proud of both the MH and CH. We moved forward a generation in heavy truck design.

My thoughts are certainly NOT about old versus new. And I don't believe anyone is "living in the past". Speaking for myself, I'm in the global market selling cutting edge Euro-6 trucks every day. Thus I speak knowing the past and present, and with inside knowledge of the future.what I'm saying is alot of the negativity is toward emissions regulations which Mack or Volvo or cummins or anyone else but the gov't can be blamed. As far as the ch goes it failed to capture the hearts of Mack customers . Also Mack was left without a halo truck that stood out from the crowd from 1993 until 2006 when the rawhide came out for highway truckers. And 2010 when the titan came out for vocational market. Mack lost alot of sales and has never recovered from that blunder. I dont know who is to blame if its Renault or Mack engineers

[Dirtymilkman]

This is all a pointless argument. I honestly love the new Macks. I love the old macks just as much. The whole whole new "image thing" is just the result of a great sales team at a advertising company. We all know the superliner should've been updated in the U.S. as it was down under. Every company has its faults and I believe Freightliner and Binder survive on cheap prices for fleet trucks. I'm glad Mack doesn't have that image.

[Lmackattack]

Barry, First off thank you for this wonderful site!! Now what I'm going to say here is just my opinion. First off I think people are pissed off at Volvo not just about Mack but about how they handled themselves in the US market with what they did to White GMC Autocars and I think if not for the Mack legend they would have pushed them off the face of the earth. If you are getting reports from Volvo about the negativity that oozes from the members who own or who would maybe own a new Mack if not for Volvo? Does Volvo realize that the diehard Mack people don't like the fact that Volvo is putting their motors transmissions into Mack trucks and just changing the name? Again just my opinion but If Volvo sees negativity coming from the members of the Mack truck site then don't you think they should be looking across each other at the board meetings and saying hey we got to change this! people aren't liking what's going on with Volvo Mack the Volvo marriage whatever you want to call it but if there arrogant then they're just going to let it go. Volvo has got to change their way of doing business in America because I don't see it getting any better with the public true they are selling a lot of trucks but I guess like you said in your post Barry we will see what happens in the future but it's up the Volvo to get some people out there and try to start to Turn the negativity around. A good start would be to have all of the US Mack engineers design and build a new motor from scratch and let it be known that this motor was entirely built and designed by the Mack engineers in United States then I would start changing the Mack to look like a Mack and not a Volvo and maybe just maybe Volvo will start winning over a lot more people and I think the negativity will start changing to a positive and I think that's all that the Mack people want is a true Mack design truck and not a Volvo with a Mack badge on it again just my opinion thank you

BULLHUSK

Well put !

Build a true Mack and die hard Mack guys will love it. Try to disguise a Volvo as a Mack and it gets called out. Pretty simple to see what's going on with the Volvo - Mack connection. I understand it's a new economy and things need to be more integrated but you can't just take a product and slap different badges on it.....remember GM in the 80's they slapped a different emblem on their cars and called them somethi g diffrent....then they had the balls to charge more for the same car. How did that work out? And you are right that if Volvo would listen to people they might gain more Mack customers that would praise both Volvo and Mack.

The only thing I hope for with the current path Mack is on is that Volvo would let the mack design team back at the helm of their product or sell off Mack to a new owner that respects the brand and knows the customer better. Sadly most new school truckers won't even consider a new Mack and I feel this is what has to change first by just building trucks that people want.

[hatcity]

IF Mack was given some latitude like the Aussies, Maybe there would be some changes

I understand, AUS. trucks have a different demand that US, but...

[jackb61sx]

I just sat here for the past half hour and read every persons post on this subject and from where I sit both sides are right. It is nice to see that everyone involved is passionate about there position and feels what they feel but the truth is things do move on and things do change with time. There is nothing wrong with a logo changing or evolving and lots of major iconic logo's have evolved and changed and at the same time the older "Built Like a Mack" slogan still is herd and spoken by those who own, preserve and maintain the old trucks There is some Irony here to crucify Volvo ( and I am not defending them) for how they operate, when Mack did the same to Brockway. I am a person who loves Mack and the emotions that the Brand stir's in people when they talk about the way things where. But at the same time Volvo has kept the brand going and alive, yes the trucks have changed and are not all Mack from bumper to tail light and maybe the parts are not kept as long as they should be but every one is like that now even Paccar. My owner I work for owns 50 Mack Visions and the trucks run every day and have been reliable trucks. I do own two trucks a B-61sx and a Superliner so I do care about the old Mack, but I also have no issue with the Volvo version of Mack, all things are global today and that is a fact none of us can overlook. That is just my thought and is not meant to offend or dismiss others opinions we all have them and should be open to all. Thx to all who may read this.

[bullhusk]

How about this... Volvo bring back the Brockway in glider kit only (rolling or power of choice inc. Volvo ) this will let the American Trucker know that Volvo' heart is in the right place? Not so hard to do, just use a R cab (just have to turn the roof around) and get the spec's from the Last Brockway Superliner that was never built.... No? Or better yet build the Brockway prototype with any engine you want even Detroit ill bet it can be done even with today's emissions and send the Volvo back to where ever. Just one more thing, I like Western Star and Freightliner cause they work for me maybe not my neighbor or uncle but for me they work! But the thing that I really like is that the Mother company did not try to flood America with there truck nor do they try an sell me a Mercedes! They build F-Liner So a da border but all the motors are built in Detroit USA as W S is still built in the US. That also I think is part of What some old school Mack guys don't like is the fact that Volvo closed US truck makers to make room for Volvo instead of building on White GMC and Autocars, whereas Mercedes took out Ford but built on Freightliner and Western Star Detroit Diesel and left there motors and trucks home!

BULLHUSK

[Challenger]

Maybe Volvo can build a Delorean with 1.21 gigawatts and send the haters back to the 70s.

[bullhusk]

Maybe Volvo can build a Delorean with 1.21 gigawatts and send the haters back to the 70s.

Was it not the head engineer at Volvo who hit his head on the bathtub putting up the clock in the bathroom ?? LOL!

[fullfuel01]

I like the song. Not enuff mack in the video.

[kscarbel2]

Full of life, color and radiating American pride, the Mack "5-Color" logo is arguably the best that the company ever used.

And certainly, the Mack "5-Color" logo is far better than the VSA Partners-designed dark medieval European-style black and white logo that Volvo plans for their Mack brand now. I hate to think how much Volvo paid VSA partners for this distasteful new brand logo.

The article below, "Mack Re-establishes Trademark", is from The Mack Bulldog, Volume 11, Number 3, 1981.

.

[mackdaddy]

kscarbel or is it kscarbel2?

Just about the time I thought you could do now wrong you state that Henry Nave.............from White motors ,,,,was a great CEO? you better talk to John "Jack" Curcio about that guy!! damn near brought Mack to it's knees. And the biggest mistake that Zenon made while at Mack was to bring Henry on board. But that is what happens when friends mix work.

[Lmackattack]

Agreed. I spoke to some friends this week about the new logo and one simply said "it sucks" the other commented that " it's bland and has a lifeless cold look to it."

the 5 color now that is an american classic logo that never gets old. I cant count How many 5 color logo have I seen proped up in a truck garage or persons home garage wall just put up on display because it looked cool...what about the red white and blue Mack logo with the stars in the letters? Was that for the 1976 year? I always liked that logo as well..

[kscarbel2]

kscarbel or is it kscarbel2?

Just about the time I thought you could do now wrong you state that Henry Nave.............from White motors ,,,,was a great CEO? you better talk to John "Jack" Curcio about that guy!! damn near brought Mack to it's knees. And the biggest mistake that Zenon made while at Mack was to bring Henry on board. But that is what happens when friends mix work.

I'm not infallible. I had dinner with Henry Nave several times and found him to be an impressive individual. Ralph Reins and Marc Gustafson certainly weren't in his league..These are my own humble thoughts.

http://www.automotivehalloffame.org/inductee/henry-nave/103/

[41180]

People complain about the Mack mp engine being Volvo. The truth is these engines are better than anything Mack put in a truck since the early mechanical e7 and vmac1and 2 and the e9. Theres 3 engines to pick from as well from 325 to 605 hp. Not just 1 outdated12 liter

[kscarbel]

People complain about the Mack mp engine being Volvo. The truth is these engines are better than anything Mack put in a truck since the early mechanical e7 and vmac1and 2 and the e9. Theres 3 engines to pick from as well from 325 to 605 hp. Not just 1 outdated12 liter

"People complain about the Mack mp engine being Volvo"

Well, I think you hit the nail on the head. In the United States market, most Americans can't imagine a Mack truck having a Volvo engine, chassis, transmission and so forth. However Americans could if the nameplate said Volvo (call a spade a spade). If you want to call it a Mack, then build a Mack. If I'd wanted a Volvo, I would have shopped for a Volvo.

Let's talk about engine size. In recent decades, Mack had three engine sizes. We had a baby eight 7.8 liter (ETZ477/E4-210), a power segment later upgraded to 9.83 liters (EM5-250/290)) to keep up with the times, the 12 liter E7 (11.93L) and the 16.4 liter V-8.

10, 12 and 16 liters, well, I would call that a well-rounded engine portfolio even in year 2014.

In both the U.S. and global markets, in both emerging and developed countries, the most popular engine size is 350-420hp in in the 11-13 liter range. And the E7 displacement wise was right there in the middle, offering a superb balance of power, fuel economy, weight and price.

And of course, the legendary Mack V-8, a true halo product, was an engine that none of Mack's competitors could touch. Mack had an entire market segment all to themselves.

[41180]

Your talking 30 yrs ago ks. I'm talking about 10 or 15 yrs ago compared to now

[kscarbel]

Your talking 30 yrs ago ks. I'm talking about 10 or 15 yrs ago compared to now

No, I'm not talking about 30 years ago. After Volvo bought Mack in 2000, they killed the 10 liter and three years later killed the E9. Thus, it was Volvo's actions that resulted in Mack being whittled down to just one engine.

[41180]

That 10 liter was a Renault design. The v8 was gone from from North America in late 98 and by that time was out of date compared to cat and Cummins big bore 6 cylinder engines because Renault didn't update it

[41180]

Your gonna say Mack had a etch v8 planned for 2003. Lol . Ive heard it before. It was to little to to late as Mack had already lost the heavy haul market by the time the v8 would of been relaunched.

[Challenger]

Old product=Old logo

New product=New logo

[bullhusk]

Your gonna say Mack had a etch v8 planned for 2003. Lol . Ive heard it before. It was to little to to late as Mack had already lost the heavy haul market by the time the v8 would of been relaunched.

So what motor is Renault running in there Magnum V-8 trucks today? Scania??

BULLHUSK