Geoff Weeks

I ran Isspro's 270 deg sweep remote shunt ammeters and loved them. I have since seen they have changed them so can't say if the new ones are as good. I could read a draw as low as 1.5 amps and they read up to 100 amps draw or charge. I'm sure someone else must still make something similar. Isspro's new gauge is more expensive and uses a sender "donut" that the cable has to pass through. I found automotive 90 deg sweep voltmeters to be inaccurate and hard to tell what is really going on. I had both gauges on all my trucks, but just because they came with voltmeters. I could see a bad cell in the battery or a bad diode just by watching the ammeter. With both it was like having a VAT connected up at all times. your gauge looks like the insulator around the mount cross bar failed

The above corrects some of the wrong info I may have inadvertently posted. Like they all have 18" ring gears not 17" and they where used in heavier axles than I listed. Sorry for the mis info, but the heavier axles are not my area so much. Been all through the lighter axles.

Well, Eaton 3 speeds did just exactly that. The only problem would be if the PDL was also engaged while it happened. Factory installs often have a interlock so the PDL can't be used if the axles are in high. With one in low and one in high, the interaxle diff has to make up the difference. as I said the 3 speeds of the 60's did just that. still they held up well enough. I have also heard (from Glenn A) that some heavy haulers retro-fitted 2 spd rear rear and a single front to add splits when hauling heavy, and they did ok. I never had a problem, and it would take major problem in the shifter for it to not shift. The air piston design is very simplistic and not much to go wrong. The earlier diaphragm air shift used a torsion spring like the electric shift do, and were more problematic, and the reason I don't like the electric and why Eaton dropped the diaphragm in favor of the piston unit.

This might help. From what I can see high speed (3.7 ratio) take a different differential case then lower ratios, so don't buy a lower ratio to re ratio to 3.7 https://www.dana.com.au/pdfs/parts-lists/AXIP-0085 Illustrated Parts List 461 to 653.pdf One advantage of the 2 spds is you use the same case halves for all available ratios.

Well, different things are "common" in different markets. 24" rubber is or was common down under and in the middle east but was not common outside the NY/NJ area in the US. 46K rears are common in dumpers but not road tractors in the US. You could spec whatever you wanted, but common spec for a road tractor was 34K for a long time then 38 and now 40K. Often when you go bigger on capacity you are required to go bigger on brakes as well, that can require other upgrades. So to keep cost down, truck were often not "Over spec'd" for their vocation. My guess is that 46K is the common spec where you are. In the US there are a lot of trucks that had 46K diffs, but not as many as those that had 40K. Rockwell SSHD's were common in dumps, I don't know the Eaton Dana share vs. Rockwell when it comes to dumps. Alot has to do with local laws, and allowed axle loads and length laws. Outside of "turnpike doubles" (2 45 or 48 ft trailers run on the turnpikes then broke into two separate units for off turnpike delivery) We didn't see a lot of high GCVW set ups. Heavy haul" was an exception. I did some of my heaviest moves with 40K rears with a GCVW in the 160-170k range. Those moves were well outside what the rears were "rated for" in GCVW, but did the job just fine, They didn't exceed the 20K/axle in the weight they carried. It is why 34K and 40K centers are all the same, only the side gears and axle shafts are different. Same for 46K and 56K centers. In full floating axles, the axle housing, bearings, brakes and axle shaft determine capacity more than ring gear size. Obviously, a 56K ring gear is going to be worked harder than a 34K even if they are powered by the same engine and transmission set, otherwise why pay for all the extra.

1st I'd make sure the 462 is interchangeable with a 461. In lighter diffs the 402 is not interchangeable with the 404. 2nd 46x and larger are less common here, but still a fair number. The adv road tractor has 40K rears, dump and off road will uprate to 46K That said I look to the major yards and gear shops. No idea what it would take to get some of these yard to ship down under.

Air shift is my favorite, Yeah, push the button down, while under load, let up or step briefly on the clutch and it down shifts. Vacuum is my 2nd with electric being last on the list. I have the Marmon with air shift and two K-7's with vacuum. Marmon has a 3406, the K-7's are 269 gassers. Like anything else, a little time in, it becomes second nature. Eaton held the patent of the planetary gearing in the 2 spds, Timken, Detroit, Rocknwell also made 2spd's but they were a double reduction units that either hung off the front or on top like a Mack. The advantage of Eaton's design is the whole thing fit inside the ring gear, the disadvatage was you were limited in what planetary ratios would fit inside the ring gear, so most often they are around .73 between low and high. Eaton, Dana and Spicer rears are all the same company (Dana Holdings Corp) now, Spicer sold of the trans business to TTC, because Roadranger was part of Eaton, so they would almost be a monopoly if both Eaton/Roadranger and Spicer heavy transmissions were one and the same company. My air shift are electric over air. Air solenoid controls air pressure to the two shift cyl on the axles. You could use an air knob on the stick, but you still need an electrical signal to the speedo or speedo adapter to keep the speedo reading correctly in both ranges. Since I needed an electric signal anyway, I went with the typical "red knob" on the side of the trans stick. Also I had a 15 speed trans that needed its own shift knob. I could have made it all air, but it would have been a rats nest of air line coming up the stick. I agree, they should be used more, and if I ever had the chance to spec a truck the way I like, they would be top on the list. Doing more of the reduction at the rear, means you don't need as heavy a driveline, like you do when most the reduction is done at the trans. Like a two or three stick, you can't be in a hurry, but once you learn them, they are great.

Here is a pic of the 402 housings and the notch I am talking about. You can clearly see the cut-out on the right side for the shift fork Edit: left side of photo, right side of front housing. You are looking at front housing faceing toward the rear of the truck.

No, it is not hard, done several myself. Lifting from the top (if you can) is better than dropping out the bottom. Neat thing about 2spd gear sets, is the ring gear is bolted to the carrier, so if you are comfortable setting up final drives, it is an easy job to change ratios. You have the selective fit on the pinion bearing to deal with and the press on spigot bearing on the end of the pinion, but all those part can fit in you boot or footwell of a car and taken to someone if you don't have the equipment to do that part of the job. Single speeds often come with the ring gear riveted to the carrier, you have to drill out and install with a bolt kit in the field. OEM use a big rivet "squeezer", but replacements are done with bolts. Make much more sense to re-use you housings if at all possible, not only do you not need to find housings that are set up for your suspension, none of the wheel end/ brake parts need to be touched. Just zip out the old and replace with the new, even the 1/2 shafts are re useable. A note on ratios, the split between low and high is almost exactly the same as dropping one gear stick position (not splitter), so many of the potential ratio's will overlap, two way to arrive at the same thing! I use mine in low for starting, than run up through the gears to top gear, than switch to high for the last two ratios. When climbing a hill it is the reverse, drop two, downshift and run the hill in direct-low. Keeps the heat out of the trans while pulling hard.

I wonder if Mikey Harbison has anything? His Dad used to quite a collection of odd stuff.

Eaton use family of gear sets. The 402's are the same center section as a 341's The 402's have a weight cap of 40K while the 341's are 34K, the only difference is the side gears that the axle spline mate into. As you would expect as the weight rating goes up, the size of the axle 1/2 shaft does also. For my purposes, this means I could use any 2 spd core from early DT340's to the latest DT402's, When I re ratioed to my chosen ratio I installed 402 side gears and then just popped the 2 spd center in place of the single 3.90's I removed. You can not build a 2 spd out of a single spd core, the carrier casting is not made the same. You need 2 spd cores to build a 2 spd axle. I went with 2spds because I could find old cores cheaper than modern single speed. As it turned out I had a 2 spd (17200) in a single axle tractor that I could re ratio and used in my "rear hole". I just needed a front core from a tandem to re ratio and I was set. I found a DT341 core and made the swap I went from 3.90's to 4.11/5.61 (? I don't remember the exact low ratio, could look it up) and gained .75-1.00 MPG. I had a 425hp 3406 and a RTO14615 in front so same .73 O/D you do, on 10.00x 20 rubber. So to recap, you need some 2 spd cores, and the rear rear is the same as use in SOME single rear trucks. The difference between rear diff "families" is the lighter (34K-40K) use either 16" or 16.5" ring gear and the larger use (I think?) 17" or 18" ring gear, obviously the houseing and center casting are different to accommodate the larger gears. The same center section was used in 46 48 and 56 (46k 48k and 56K) rears with differing side gears in each. I think the 18200 single rear would be of the same "family" as your 46's. The question you have to answer is if you housings will accept a 2 spd center? For example: the bolt circle and housing size is the same on a set of IHC 472's and Eaton 402, and you would think you could sub in a Eaton but the area around the axle line is notched out to allow the shift fork on DT and DC axle models on an Eaton housing, it is not on the IHC. I don't know if all Eaton housing are built like this. Mine were in a Marmon, a low production truck, so I would guess Marmon would order only one Eaton housing for use in all Eaton rear trucks. They would only need to stock one, and drop in whatever center the build sheet called for. I have heard conflicting info from yards and builders as to whether all Eaton housings are provided with the cut-out or not. Some say yes, other say no. Mine were. In your case, where I don't see a 2 spd 462, I would check your housing before ordering a set of cores. On the housing at the center line where the axle goes there are two bolts (top and bottom) and the axle center line passed between them. on the rear rear left and front rear right, the opening will have a [ or the right of front and ] on left of the rear instead of being ( ) {equal on both sides} in other word it will look like [ ) on the front and ( ] on the rear. You can only see this with the center section out. If this is not clear I can try and get some pic's of a set of Eaton 402 housings.

Ah, bad new, I can't find a DT 462, if you had 461's you could replace the DS/RS 461 centers with DT 461 centers. Eaton numbering goes like this: D= front tandem or tandem set DS tandem set single speed DT tandem set 2 spd DC traction control single If you had DS 461's DT sets were made. But since 2 spds have dropped from favor the latest axles didn't have 2 spds The DS 402's (40K singles) could take DT 402's or any center in that "family", and be made into a 402 by changing the side gears to match the axle shaft. Same held true for the larger 46K axles. I don't know if the larger axle housings are the same as the smaller, with the "notch" to allow traction control or 2 spds. like the smaller housings were, the single speed housings will accept 2 spd or traction control centers. If you find that 461's will bolt into your 462 housings, than there is the chance that you could get older 2 spds the high/low ratio is always the same split, it is fixed by the planetary ratio inside. They come in most all the same ratio's as singles do in high so yes 3.70/5.05 or 4.11/5.61 would suit. n 1st thing before you go on a search, is talk to Eaton rep or a knowledgeable gear shop to tell your options on the DS462 "family". of rears. This is exactly what I did on my truck, replaced DS402's with DT402's I built up from cores.

My Dart, the only truck I have with more than one stick, the aux is to the right of the main. That gives more room.

My size 15's would have trouble with that! Thank's for the picture. How hard is it to drive with the stick there?

I have to remember your rules are different, here a ratio change is not something anybody but you have to know about, If grade ability is a problem, the 2 spd axles can extend both ends, but that will rule out lockers. One or the other but not both.

I think with a 18, that will not be a problem, they have a fair spread, but as I say, do the math, look at total reduction as well. The disadvantage of the 18 is all the reduction is done up front, so the driveline has to handle it.

The British buses had taper pins also, they took a large Kin Pin press to get them out, sometime with heat to the knuckle. Look out when they finely release! Shot one down into a brick floor and punched the brick down a bit! Sounded like a rifle shot.

My advice is don't guess or take someone else's guess. Get the graph of the power torque and BSFC curves for the EXACT engine you have, then do the math to find what ratio will put you at the lowest point in the BSFC curve at the speed you want to cruise at. My experience is slightly different than yours, as I didn't have all the gear choices that 18 does. However after hours of pawing though the math, and plotting on graph paper, I selected the ratio that got me as close to my ideal as possible. I have never regretted the ratio choice and left me with a much more comfortable truck to drive, and upped my mileage between .75 and one full mile per gal. You'll need the rev's/mile of the tires you are running as well. Once you have it centered in the low spot on the BSFC curve, with all those splits on the top end, if the torque rise is a problem you can drop a ratio or two when you need to pull a small rise, and go all the way down to direct when pulling a steeper rise. The factory did the hard work of plotting all this stuff, the info you can't easily get from the driver seat, so ask them for a copy.

May be it is the angle of the picture, but it looks like stick placement is in the way of the pedals! My Marmon has a Eaton 15/OD (12 useable) coupled to a set of tandem 2 spds. More gears then necessary but nice, esp when moving big loads. Some of the 12 front ratios can be duplicated with the 2 spd, so I didn't use all 24 possible. Generally started with the rears in low range (normal reduction) and once I hit 45 or so hit high range, climbing hills I would drop 2 gears in high then switch to low. Deep reduction was only used to start on soft ground or for maneuvering heavy loads in tight spaces.

The one pictured is in the scrap pile. I am just interested in finding the info, Truck is a 45-50 mph truck, will do 60 but I don't run it there. I my lifetime of trucking I have lost 4 steers, two at 70 mph, and never found them hard to control. Granted they were loaded to 12K not 20K floats, but still. Bang! mash the throttle, make sure you have a firm grip on the wheel, guide to the shoulder, while slowing. Don't jerk the wheel or mash the brakes. Never left my lane because of the blow out. Two were tube type, two were tubeless. If you wait to react until you feel it, you are putting yourself at a disadvantage. It may be the truck next to you that blew a tire, but I react 1st and then assess the situation. I imagine a 20K float would be more a handful, but I never found a steer blow-out to be a death-ride.

Thanks to all. To be clear, I am not looking for tires, but for spec's on that size. Once mine are no longer useable, I will replace with 8.25 x 20 s like I did on the rear. So far my search has not found anyone with the spec's including someone who claimed to search through older tire/rim mfg spec books. I just have never come across a tire I couldn't find a spec somewhere. So far I have just guessed at the pressure for the load they are carrying. At the rate I put miles on the truck, they may outlast my lifetime. I have yet to see another tire with that size, so if Mowerman does have one, that will mark the 1st time I have seen them other than the set I had. 8.25 x 20's are getting harder to find, back when I 1st got this truck you could still get domestic radials in that size, now import bias is all there are, and those have jumped in price considerably.

Otherwise you could just use the 6306 bearing!

They were weird, that is for sure. I flew into Tulsa to build up a pressure plate and install a clutch in one, then drive it to Chicago. It was a bad idea from the start, and I told them so. The bus had been a "static display" in a field for years, I got the clutch in and fixed a bunch of other stuff, got it running OK, but after running it around Tulsa for a day or so, trying to shake the bugs out of it, I made it just out of the city limits before the rings seized in the piston and it started knocking real bad. You can't take an engine like that, that had been sitting and expect it to run fine. I flew back to Chicago and the bus came in on a hook. New piston and ring on one hole and it was fine.

Yeah I could, but I am really more interested in the other spec's. I have no load info on it other than the 12 ply rating, no pressure chart to know how much to put in for a given load. I am running them on the front of the K-7, I have 8.25 x 20's in the rear. That gives me a top end of close to 60 MPH which is all I need. I doubt I'll overload them, but would be nice to know the spec's No one has ever been able to come up with any, which is odd in itself. Add to that, the size that doesn't follow the normal sizing. 8.5 x 20 "should" be bigger than an 8.25 x 20".

Years ago, when working on the British buses, I was looking for a clutch, They had weird single disk 17" or 17"+ something (17 3/4"?) that the lining was 11/16" thick. I remember we came on a Mack clutch that was similar in size but was a pull clutch and thinner lining. I don't remember what it was off of now. I just remember it wasn't going to work. It was a weird clutch those buses used, once it wore to where there was no more adjustment, you changed the position on the release finger pivot and got another "life" out of it. IIRC there were three setting on the finger pivots. The flywheel had a replaceable wear surface, so if it got badly scored, you could just replace the wear surface like you would the center plate on multi disk clutches. Never understood why they went that way (big single disk) over smaller multi plate.