Dan107 Posted February 19, 2022 Author Share Posted February 19, 2022 I'm going to get a combustion leak detector kit today and check my coolant for exhaust gasses. Would a bad injector cup let exhaust gas get into the coolant reservoir? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joey Mack Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 I have to admit... I've only done about a dozen MP harness's, it's been 4+ years since the last one, until 2 weeks ago.. Take a guess on what I did??? JOJO 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joey Mack Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 Yes,,, if compression/cumbustion squeezes between the injector seat of the cup, and the bore in the head. I would expect it to push coolant. jojo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joey Mack Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 Another thing,,,, I dont mean to question youre skill's, but I have to ask... When you cleaned the cup bores, did you have all of the cups out or just 2? if so, was the cleaning process thorough? there are galleries in between that can hide particles and bristles from any brushes, and so on. did you make sure the seats were free of carbon and debris before seating the cud. did you use the correct cup installing tool? sorry about all the Q's, but i have to ask.. was the swaging bit new or within specs? ok, I will stop here for now.. with respect, Jojo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan107 Posted February 19, 2022 Author Share Posted February 19, 2022 No issues with questions here, it's how we get better. As far as the cleaning process, I believe I have the correct tools. I'm kinda OCD when it comes to prep work, so I'm comfortable that it was clean and ready. The seating tool I have has only been used once before when I changed the original cups out along with a new injector set. Purchased the truck and less than 90 days later the bull gear failed...The engine warranty I purchased when I financed the truck had a neat little clause in it that allowed them to get out of paying for the repair. I call it the "nut clause". If a part was attached by a torqued nut, and the nut failed, the insurance would not pay...That was an expensive fix. I said all of that because two months later injector and cup failure began. It was a tough first year with the truck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joey Mack Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 I'm so sorry... I have only done 3 bull gear replacements, and yes it is a big, EXPENSIVE job. the last one I did was in a GU rolloff trash truck. I pulled the engine on that one. I also had to do a harness, rods and mains, and a valve adjustment. So I decided to pull it.. When my servivce manager got back from training and saw the engine on blocks, he flipped out and looked at me and asked what was I thinking, and said we dont need any Mavericks here.. I just finished my work, and when the time came to test drive the truck, I didnt have to go back and re-fix a damn thing.. anyway, a bit off topic, just wanted to share some history.. jojo 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onyx610 Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 46 minutes ago, Dan107 said: I'm going to get a combustion leak detector kit today and check my coolant for exhaust gasses. Would a bad injector cup let exhaust gas get into the coolant reservoir? Yup, like I said earlier the combustion gas can go into the fuel or coolant. Just depends on if it goes on the inside or outside of the cup. Hopefully this doesn’t turn into anything more then a cup for you. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan107 Posted February 19, 2022 Author Share Posted February 19, 2022 6 minutes ago, Onyx610 said: Yup, like I said earlier the combustion gas can go into the fuel or coolant. Just depends on if it goes on the inside or outside of the cup. Hopefully this doesn’t turn into anything more then a cup for you. So, is there any definitive test I can do to determine if it's a cup, or bad cylinder? First, I really appreciate all the help from everyone here. You guys have helped me get through issues on many occasions, but this cup thing seems, at least in my mind, crappy! I guess I'm just being lazy, but the steps needed to pull the cover, pull the rocker assembly, the injector, then the cup and replace without knowing for sure seems labor intensive. Don't get me wrong, I'm not questioning anyone here. I'm just trying to get to the answer the simplest way possible...😎 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onyx610 Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 Hahaha yea I get it man, I completely feel for you. It’s a shame these are such a pain to tear down. There isn’t really any pin point tests that I know of. It’s pretty much just a known issue and the symptoms that come with either combustion gas in the fuel side or coolant side. Even then the main test is the clear hose either in the fuel return or clear hose from head to surge tank to check for bubbles. Also another one is what your getting ready to do, combustion gas detector. Only problem is that it could be other things if combustion gas is found. Like egr cooler, head gasket, or cracked head. Which I highly doubt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan107 Posted February 19, 2022 Author Share Posted February 19, 2022 (edited) Okay, I got the combustion gas test done and it was positive. Also, for whatever reason, now I have oil literally running a steady stream out of the crank case vent tube from the ventilation cannister. I think I'm just going to set this thing on fire!!! Edited February 19, 2022 by Dan107 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeH Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 Lol sounds miserable! Clean your crankcase vent filter. I'm assuming the mp series engines use one. The ETechs use a steel wool donut that clogs up over time. If your vent is plugged up it'll pressurize the crankcase. Even a tiny bit of pressure will cause things to leak. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onyx610 Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 (edited) Ok so time to go back to the offending cylinder…now for the blow by, those crankcase vent spinners are very expensive so I’m not gonna tell you to just throw one at it. There have been issues with them though. May want to check for pinched hoses. Edited February 19, 2022 by Onyx610 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onyx610 Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 (edited) You can’t clean the filter on these. These are a centrifugal style filter and I believe you have to buy the whole housing. How many miles are on this truck? It could be very loaded up and blowing out past the o rings. Edited February 19, 2022 by Onyx610 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mechohaulic Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 6 hours ago, Joey Mack said: I'm so sorry... I have only done 3 bull gear replacements, and yes it is a big, EXPENSIVE job. the last one I did was in a GU rolloff trash truck. I pulled the engine on that one. I also had to do a harness, rods and mains, and a valve adjustment. So I decided to pull it.. When my servivce manager got back from training and saw the engine on blocks, he flipped out and looked at me and asked what was I thinking, and said we dont need any Mavericks here.. I just finished my work, and when the time came to test drive the truck, I didnt have to go back and re-fix a damn thing.. anyway, a bit off topic, just wanted to share some history.. jojo it's amazing how there are those that put time vs quality on a job. do it right the first time makes more sense ; then there won't be a second time for the same situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan107 Posted February 19, 2022 Author Share Posted February 19, 2022 53 minutes ago, Onyx610 said: Ok so time to go back to the offending cylinder…now for the blow by, those crankcase vent spinners are very expensive so I’m not gonna tell you to just throw one at it. There have been issues with them though. May want to check for pinched hoses. You are correct sir, I got a quote today for $1500 drive out, with the gasket needed between the canister and the block....So, I did clean it up and put a "rebuild" kit in it. It was nothing but a set of new gaskets. The internals seem clean, and free of damage. The wheel spinner turns freely. It was running oil out at 1100RPM's and stopped when I went back to idle. I had spoken with another diesel engine tech and was told to do another injector cut-out test to see if the blowby decreased when cylinder 1 was turned off. 53 minutes ago, Onyx610 said: You can’t clean the filter on these. These are a centrifugal style filter and I believe you have to buy the whole housing. How many miles are on this truck? It could be very loaded up and blowing out past the o rings. 952000 miles on this truck, and I've had it since 533000. There are a few video's of the internals being cleaned, and as I mentioned, a "kit" is sold to replace the o rings inside. I pulled the valve cover off, and it looks like I have very fine particles of metal up top. Granted, they are like a fine powder, but looks and feels like metal to me. I've pulled the cup from #1 cylinder, and as soon as my snake camera is charged, I'm going to take a look down in the cylinder to see if I can find any damage. Luckily, when the gov was giving PPP loans, I purchased a complete in-frame kit for it in case this were to happen. It's been sitting in my shop. We'll see what it looks like inside and go from there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onyx610 Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 Yea cleaning them doesn’t do much of anything, the cut out test on the cylinder is a good idea. Did the cup in the cylinder show any soot/pitting on the outside? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan107 Posted February 19, 2022 Author Share Posted February 19, 2022 9 minutes ago, Onyx610 said: Yea cleaning them doesn’t do much of anything, the cut out test on the cylinder is a good idea. Did the cup in the cylinder show any soot/pitting on the outside? I saw nothing on the outside of the cup. Still shines. The injector was really sooted up at the nozzle though and I cleaned them up when I changed the cups before. Don’t know if that means anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onyx610 Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 (edited) Are you able to do a compression test or leak down test? Not using tech tool? That sooted up nozzle Is pry from it not firing correctly hence being your “injector 1 error code” or compression loss. If you still can take a magnet to the oil to verify if it’s metal. Edited February 19, 2022 by Onyx610 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan107 Posted February 19, 2022 Author Share Posted February 19, 2022 So, could all this be just a faulty injector? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onyx610 Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 No, because you have combustion gas in the coolant system. Id Iike to see the cup re installed and a legit compression/leak down test done. I think you have a few things going on but we need to start figuring out one thing to get to the next. One thing might tell us the rest of the story. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onyx610 Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 This might help you understand what’s going on better then what I can explain. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onyx610 Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 (edited) I really wish @fjh would get on here to help you out more then I can. Edited February 19, 2022 by Onyx610 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joey Mack Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 yep, and 'V' is pretty slick too.... and Mackpro.... jojo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onyx610 Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 Yes they are @Vmac3 @Mackpro 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onyx610 Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 I strongly believe we can figure this out, do you have the tools to do those tests? They cost a good bit of money….I hope some of the “big dogs” as I like to call them that i mentioned earlier will chime In soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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