New guy, lots of questions...

[Engine1252]

I'm a lifelong fan of Mack trucks, and as I approach retirement from the fire department I can finally say I am the proud owner, along with my family, of a B85 pumper! Not just any Mack, but THE Mack that my father drove me and my brothers around in when we were children.

Finding it and acquiring it makes for a cool story for another time. What I am looking for with some immediacy is information on the ignition system. It is in the shop, and the mechanic is having issues with the distributor. Where is a good place to start looking for components of the ignition system? It is a gas 707 with a 5 speed transmission.

I appreciate any and all help, and trust me I will need a lot of it. I have spent my career on a heavy rescue, so please use small words and pictures if possible.😃

Thanks!

Glenn

[CaptainCrutch]

Awesome truck man! You’ll probably get the info you need to your mechanic if you contact the Mack Museum. There’s 3 different versions of the 707 engine and each one had different ignition timing and governor speeds.

[1958 F.W.D.]

Hey Engine1252, Welcome. I assume you are originally from Lansdale. I have a similar story to you- I now own Bryn Athyn's old 1958 F.W.D. pumper which is the first truck I ever rode on. My dad took me to a parade in Bridgeport when I was three and a half. I bought it in 2001 from the small town in south Jersey that bought it from Bryn Athyn in July of 1978. We also own the 1978 Hahn pumper that replaced the F.W.D. so we own two generations of Engine 1102. 

Ignition system parts are easy. Contact Joe Bertino at Vineland Auto Electric in Vineland NJ. He is a member of SPAAMFAA and owns an old Mack himself. They specialize in electrical system components on modern and antique fire apparatus. 

As for the Mack Museum, it is completely shut down right now due to the health crisis, and Staff is not working. It is not known when they will start back up, it is assumed when the national crisis has been declared safe and all states of emergencies have been rescinded. Even under normal circumstances, you would be asked to submit museum requests by this link: https://www.macktruckshistoricalmuseum.org/contact-us/  A suitable donation is requested. 

Requests are processed in the order in which received. Normally the wait is 4-6 weeks but I can only imagine there will be a backup when this is all said and done. 
 
 

[Hook n ladder 1]

Welcome Glenn.

I to am getting ready to retire; spent most of my time on an engine and some on a tower ladder.  You know what we say about you rescue guys (squad guys here in the midwest)?  You guys have real short __________!!!!   (attention span?   fill in the blank.  LOL)  There's a lot of great guys on this site and they appreciate truckers banter which is similar to the firehouse banter.

[Mack458]

Glenn, welcome and congratulations on your truck. I have a 1965 B95 with a 707C Gasoline engine. I have found that most of the ignition components are GM and as said parts are easily available. A lot of folks recomend NAPA for parts. A good NAPA dealer will research your parts and find what you need. One of the problems I have heard of is with the points, so most folks will update to an electronic ignition. You will need two, and they are pretty easy to install. Also you remove the points and condensor eliminating those parts. 

I use Pertronix electronic ignition parts. You will need to get the distributor model number off the side of the distributor, and then call Pertronix to get the proper part number. Summit racing sells them and they ship free.  When you speak with Petronix give them as much information as you can, especially if it is a positive ground system. NAPA numbers on my truck : CAP RR162  ROTOR RR161.  

You came to the right place. Members have a wealth of knowledge. As suggested contact the museum for your truck's records and send them a donation.

Mark

 

[j hancock]

Welcome!  Nothing better than a truck with some personal history to your family.

[Engine1252]

Thanks for the warm welcome and all of the information!  Kinda feels like a firehouse kitchen table around here. 👍

I'll be making calls tomorrow to get the ball rolling. Can't wait to get her out on the road. It's our turn to give dad a ride!

Cheers!

Glenn

[Firemack]

Engine 1252

You might want to consider changing over to electronic ignition to improve the performance and remove any chance of the points and condensor causing any problems. I used a Pertronix electronic ignition module for a 12 volt positive ground system. The parts are still available at NAPA but I like the quality of the parts from Brillman Company- he uses all brass fittings etc. I still purchased plugs from NAPA- AC R45. The points, condensor, (or electronic ignition module), cap, rotor and wires, I purchased from Brillman Company in Mt Jackson VA. Contact John Brillman at 540-477-4112, he is a nice guy, and you may see him at a VA truck meet as he has an old Autocar tractor.

Once you install the ignition parts you will need a regular timing light attached the positive (red lead) and negative (black lead) of the battery (and the timing lead connected to number one spark plug wire on one of the distributors at a time). The timing light does not need to reversed for positive ground and will most likely ruin the timing light if not correctly connected. You can use a engine dwell tach or engine analyzer with the red lead connected to the primary wire of the distributor (Ground) and the black lead connected to the ignition hot at the coil. This can then be used to set the dwell (if you decide to use points and condensor) or to monitor the engine rpm to set the idle mixture and idle speed. Timing on a 707C is done on the flywheel under the truck not on the front pulley. You set the dwell and then set the timing. Do one distributor at a time and it makes it easy to get the truck started (on the one you have not changed) and then adjust the timing on the one you just updated. After setting the dwell and timing on both then set the idle mixture for the highest idle speed, then reset the idle speed. I usually set the idle at about 600 rpm but can be set as low as 350 if you like it there.

If you mark the wires and send them to John Brillman he makes the original style (Packard 440) wire sets in the exact size of the wire set you send him and is reasonably priced (a little more than Napa). This way you have an exact replacement wire set and not some mix and match from a parts catalog.

Good luck,

Firemack

[mackdump600@yahoo.com]

Hi engine 1252 my name is Tom I am from South Western PA I have a 70 or 6:08 with a 707 C in it and my recommendations is do the electronics pertronix points also put a pyrometer on it my carburetor cleaned out and I didn't know it and it burnt the Pistons down the sides $7,000 to repair so keep an eye on the temperature enjoy

[609albert]

WELCOME  TO THE GROUP ,all of the previous replies are all pointing you in the right directions ,I have  a 54 LS85 open cab , Petronics ignition system installed (make a big difference) also check your air cleaner ,I changed to a Vortex (from AutoZone) of course not an OEM but better, next thing I'm doing is changing oil filter from a sock to spin on (not a OEM but who cares). I have a friend who owns the Landsdale C model Mack.

[Engine1252]

Great information guys. Thanks!! We did make the conversion already to a spin-on oil filter, and the air cleaner is next. We are going to make the ignition system change to Pertronix. 

Standby for more questions...

 

Cheers!

Glenn

[Firemack]

Glenn,

I switched to K&N air filter, K&N made it to fit right in the original Mack Chrome air cleaner. Replaces the original steel wool air cleaner. You can contact K&N and they have filters sized on what you need  to fit in the original mack filter and engine displacement. 

Firemack

 

[BiloxiTruck10]

Howdy, name's Brandon. I'm from Biloxi, MS and I'm 17 years old and I know a whole lot about all different types of fire apparatus, and Biloxi used to have a couple Mack CF Pumpers from my knowledge and they used to have a CF Rear Mount Aerial and it got destroyed by Hurricane Katrina and I was wondering if they was anyone that knew any information on the truck or has any photographs of Biloxi's Mack CFs or Mack CF Aerial, and nowadays Biloxi has nothing but E-Ones. 

[j hancock]

16 hours ago, BiloxiTruck10 said:

or has any photographs of Biloxi's Mack CFs or Mack CF Aerial

Have you had a chance to check with the fire dept.  Usually they keep a couple photos of their past equipment.

[BiloxiTruck10]

On 4/13/2020 at 6:23 AM, j hancock said:

Have you had a chance to check with the fire dept.  Usually they keep a couple photos of their past equipment.

I've been in the Chief's office once and he had a picture of the old Mack CF Mid-Mount Aerial and I never managed to get a picture of it. However some if the other stations have photos of their older E-Ones, not Macks.

[1958 F.W.D.]

On 4/12/2020 at 4:28 PM, BiloxiTruck10 said:

Howdy, name's Brandon. I'm from Biloxi, MS and I'm 17 years old and I know a whole lot about all different types of fire apparatus, and Biloxi used to have a couple Mack CF Pumpers from my knowledge and they used to have a CF Rear Mount Aerial and it got destroyed by Hurricane Katrina and I was wondering if they was anyone that knew any information on the truck or has any photographs of Biloxi's Mack CFs or Mack CF Aerial, and nowadays Biloxi has nothing but E-Ones. 

Many fire apparatus and fire apparatus photographer groups on facebook

[v8steel]

On 4/10/2020 at 7:10 AM, Engine1252 said:

Great information guys. Thanks!! We did make the conversion already to a spin-on oil filter, and the air cleaner is next. We are going to make the ignition system change to Pertronix. 

Standby for more questions...

 

Cheers!

Glenn

Engine1252:  Did you upgrade to the Pertronix yet?  What is the pertronix part number?  What is the delco distributor part number or series number.  I need to do the same upgrade.

Thank you!

[Engine1252]

Good morning!

Did not switch to the Pertronix yet. We got sidetracked with some other issues that required machining new parts for the drive line. The ignition switch over will occur sometime this winter. I'll get you those part numbers ASAP, unless one of the other fine folks on here beats me to it. This is definitely the place to get answers and help. Good luck!

 

Glenn

[49Fire]

For those searching ignition, starter or charging parts, NAPAPROLINK.COM website has an on line catalog section under the heading of "specials". under ignition books is one that gives unit number to parts Simply search for the unit number on the tag or stamped into your part, and it will show you the available components for it. The 49 I am working with listed points, condenser, rotor, but not the cap. 

next move is to search the rotor number for what other cap i may be able to use with it. Good luck.

[Engine1252]

Hey guys,

Been a little tied up lately, but I wanted to post an update on our family B85. This engine has a family history and the story of how we found it and came to own it is borderline unbelievable. With the help of our mechanic Ricky Jones, the talented Dave Amon of D&M Fabrication, and many of you on here we have made considerable progress. We are not done, and we will continue to reach out with questions. 

Here are some pictures. One is Dad operating at a propane storage unit fire, one is the day we found it, and a shot from today.

Cheers!

Glenn