E9 500 V8 Mack Vs 3408 V8 Cat

[brutus998]

I have heard these two are comparable motors....but the v8 mack is more reliable in road use any truth to that? I heard that you can get some major HP from the 3408 cats but the Crank is prone to snap. They definately sound the same, there is no better sound in the world than the E9 w/ straight pipes

[Rob]

I can't say I've ever been around an E9 Mack engine but most speak favorably (except for parts) of them. My wife has seen many broken 34XX series crankshafts though, as she is directly involved with Cat warranty issues at the manufacturing level. I can tell you they are not inexpensive on parts either!!

Rob

[K-Whopper]

I've driven both but didn't really think they sounded the same.

The E-9 sure is a sweet sounding engine, the closest I've ever heard to one is a Scania 14 liter V8.

[b61mack]

I've driven both but didn't really think they sounded the same.

The E-9 sure is a sweet sounding engine, the closest I've ever heard to one is a Scania 14 liter V8.

What cubic inch is the 3408 cat.

[ThaddeusW]

What cubic inch is the 3408 cat.

18.2 liters or 1099.65 CID.

You can get the spec sheets from cat.com

Those spec sheets are for industrial engines but should be the same as the ones they made for trucks.

[bubbamobilin]

I have heard these two are comparable motors....but the v8 mack is more reliable in road use any truth to that? I heard that you can get some major HP from the 3408 cats but the Crank is prone to snap. They definately sound the same, there is no better sound in the world than the E9 w/ straight pipes

/quote

Rob is exactly right. The 3408's snap cranks because the block is cast on a 60 degree V and the E9 is a 90 degree V. I learned this from the master himself JR Collins. 60 degrees is not enough room to keep all that spinning cast iron out of the way of itself. E9's also get better fuel economy.

[Barry]

We have sold some 4" cat back side pipe conversions for the Ford 7.3 Powerstrokes...I gotta say that they sound very simular to the Mack V8!

[Diesel Brad]

Buddy of mine told me he just went through a CAT 3408 with a snapped crank. He said the new crank is $15,000. He even repeated himself when I asked him was he sure -

[mudslut28]

Thats the reason I never would touch a Cat motor..... I can rebuild 4 or 5 Mack motors for the same price. Parts are absolutely ridiculous for them things. God forbid you have to pull a head on a Cat motor also..

[Diesel Brad]

Thats the reason I never would touch a Cat motor..... I can rebuild 4 or 5 Mack motors for the same price. Parts are absolutely ridiculous for them things. God forbid you have to pull a head on a Cat motor also..

That was one thing Detroit Diesels used to have going for them - GM had some sort of low cost parts rule.

I do remember the 3208s having a 2 ring piston design for a while: What were they thinking ?

[redacted]

Buddy of mine told me he just went through a CAT 3408 with a snapped crank. He said the new crank is $15,000. He even repeated himself when I asked him was he sure -

Why would he pay $15,000 for a 3408 crank when you can get them for $3,300 from agkits.com or a full 3408 for $8,500 from dieselsales.com?

[BAD DOG]

My dad had a 3408 Cat in a 1980 Freightliner coe and a couple of E9's one in a 94 CL 600 and one in a 90 Superliner. He put over a million and a half miles on the 3408 haulling 140,000 lb plus loads without putting a wrench on it. It was a really good engine for him. The 94 CL with E9 500 was more nimble than the Cat was and was alot cleaner engine, no oil leaks like the Cat and no smoke out the exhaust like the Cat. I'd still like to have a 3408 in the collection someday. Both trucks I can still remember the similar sound each made I used to be able to tell when dad was coming home you could hear him come off the highway and turn down our road. They both sounded like locomotives.

[farmer52]

My dad had a 3408 Cat in a 1980 Freightliner coe and a couple of E9's one in a 94 CL 600 and one in a 90 Superliner. He put over a million and a half miles on the 3408 haulling 140,000 lb plus loads without putting a wrench on it. It was a really good engine for him. The 94 CL with E9 500 was more nimble than the Cat was and was alot cleaner engine, no oil leaks like the Cat and no smoke out the exhaust like the Cat. I'd still like to have a 3408 in the collection someday. Both trucks I can still remember the similar sound each made I used to be able to tell when dad was coming home you could hear him come off the highway and turn down our road. They both sounded like locomotives.

Those 3408s were sweet. I would like to find one too!

[rsb502]

I have been around a couple 3408's and they are nice engines when theyre right but as above the cranks dont hold up to much power, I was told by a Cat man once that in stock configuration they will last a million miles but turn up the fuel and they will snap in 50,000, it was due to the angle as above, he told me they made the tighter angle so it would fit into truck frames, if you look at the two side by side even though the 3408 is larger it is not as wide as the E9. I would still rather have my E9 but Id love to have a 3408 in an old W900 A model ext hood too!

[farmer52]

I have been around a couple 3408's and they are nice engines when theyre right but as above the cranks dont hold up to much power, I was told by a Cat man once that in stock configuration they will last a million miles but turn up the fuel and they will snap in 50,000, it was due to the angle as above, he told me they made the tighter angle so it would fit into truck frames, if you look at the two side by side even though the 3408 is larger it is not as wide as the E9. I would still rather have my E9 but Id love to have a 3408 in an old W900 A model ext hood too!

The 3408 (and I believe the 3412) uses an offset/split rod journal. That is how they get the "narrow" V configuration.

[BAD DOG]

Yes that's true an E9 won't fit in just any truck frame. That's whyRW's MH's and CL's the frames are wide at the front, just to fit an E9. They won't fit between a set of CH framerails. Another truck I would like in my collection is a 1977 F Model with a 1693 Cat that I've had my eye on for quite a few years. I just need those dam lottery numbers to pay off for me.

[JohnCArnold]

I bought my Superliner just for the sound of the E9...it's only the 400 HP version (it's a 1980), but I converted it to dual 6" straight pipes last winter and how it's actually a little too loud. But I want to go back to the posting that Barry made in 2006, about the Ford (International, dammit, not Ford!) "Powerstroke" engines - they really do have the same stuttering sound of an E9 when under mild load at relatively low RPMs. I haven't gotten around to looking up the firing orders, but I'm thinking that's where the similarity starts.

[BAD DOG]

I bought my Superliner just for the sound of the E9...it's only the 400 HP version (it's a 1980), but I converted it to dual 6" straight pipes last winter and how it's actually a little too loud. But I want to go back to the posting that Barry made in 2006, about the Ford (International, dammit, not Ford!) "Powerstroke" engines - they really do have the same stuttering sound of an E9 when under mild load at relatively low RPMs. I haven't gotten around to looking up the firing orders, but I'm thinking that's where the similarity starts.

You say 6" is a bit too loud. I've been trying to get my hands on some stainless pipe and elbows in 8" and make myself a pair of custom stacks for my E9. I just have the 5" run to the back of the cab now and haven't had it out on the road to get on it hard yet just to see how loud it is. I had a set of 6" straight pipes on my 866 V8 and it wasn't too bad. and I had a set of cheap mufflers that I cut apart and took all the insides out on my E9 before and it was actually reall quiet. If my guy doesn't get back to me on the stainless pipe I'll pobably see if I can't pick up some 6 " or 7" down at MATS in Louisville in march. I wish I would have bought the 7" from the Riker guy last year I passed on a set of 7" 8' miter cuts last year for $600 on the saturday, I might have got em for less since he didn't want to load them back on his trailer, but I hadn't had my truck running yet at the time. So I left them there.

[oilburner]

I know a guy that used to run a 3408 in a peterbilt, he got it with low miles pulled a flatbed, i think it was around 600 hp from the factory and he claimed he got 5.5miles per gallon, but i never got the chance to ride it, just herd his storys. My old man ran with him some and he had a cabover with a 1693 in just a 425 hp but he did say it would do nothing with it, as far as crank problems, he never had any but it did suck a vavle and maybe got a head gasket once. Have no idea about the e9's would love to get the chance to pull with either engine but to hard to find around here. There used to be a heavy haul co. local here that had one and he said it had to be overhauled every 250,000 to 300,000 miles that's all you could put on them he said, but with a d 11 on the back not many trucks would make it 30 miles, he sold it recently in auction along with alot of cool stuf, they had some old autocars with v12 detriots in them i don't know which one, but the things sounded mean, they were in the 70's maybe early 80's they had 4 stacks on the back 2 side by side really cool looking old trucks.

[JohnCArnold]

BAD DOG,

The other thing I didn't mention is that I also had to go with short stacks in order to get through my 10' garage door. When I built the garage 5 years ago, I had only the B61 and B815 (with 864 V8), and 10' was a convenient height. But now the Superliner needs to live in there during the winters, so I went with short stacks - which means that the outlets are only about a foot and a half above the top of the cab windows.

I have the same single 5" pipe running under the cab, then I went through a Y and ran horizontally out to the sides and through 90 elbows to vertical all in 5", then got stacks that start at 5 but expand to 6. They're only 5' long, so maybe the combination of short length, expansion in the stack itself, and low outlet height makes a difference.

What was your 866 in, and how did you mount and plumb those pipes? I'm thinking of putting duals on the B815 someday. There was a guy at the Auburn, Indiana ATHS show back on 2005 who had a nice setup on his B815, but I didn't pay enough attention to how he had mounted the non-standard stack on the driver's side. My first step will be to put on the single 4" straight pipe that came off my B61 when I switched it to duals back on '05, but I don't think I'll be satisfied with that forever.

[rsb502]

I have 5" exhaust turbo back to just under the cab on both sides then into 6" elbows and 96" tall 6" miters, I think its quieter than my 84 with one 5", by quite a bit actually I know when I added the Dynomat to the interior of my 84 it cut the road/engine/exhaust noise by at least 30% inside, it makes a Superliner truly Super to take the interior out and put in sound insulation. on a side note I have heard an E9 truck with 6" exhaust and stack mufflers inside and while it cuts noise by about a third it just doesnt sound like a strong running truck to me, you lose the E9 pop.

[BAD DOG]

BAD DOG,

The other thing I didn't mention is that I also had to go with short stacks in order to get through my 10' garage door. When I built the garage 5 years ago, I had only the B61 and B815 (with 864 V8), and 10' was a convenient height. But now the Superliner needs to live in there during the winters, so I went with short stacks - which means that the outlets are only about a foot and a half above the top of the cab windows.

I have the same single 5" pipe running under the cab, then I went through a Y and ran horizontally out to the sides and through 90 elbows to vertical all in 5", then got stacks that start at 5 but expand to 6. They're only 5' long, so maybe the combination of short length, expansion in the stack itself, and low outlet height makes a difference.

What was your 866 in, and how did you mount and plumb those pipes? I'm thinking of putting duals on the B815 someday. There was a guy at the Auburn, Indiana ATHS show back on 2005 who had a nice setup on his B815, but I didn't pay enough attention to how he had mounted the non-standard stack on the driver's side. My first step will be to put on the single 4" straight pipe that came off my B61 when I switched it to duals back on '05, but I don't think I'll be satisfied with that forever.

My door on my garage is only 12 ft high so I can only use 7ft stacks on mine. My 866 was in my Superliner that I'm in the process of restoring. The truck was a glider done from a 74 F700 driveline. I'm redoing it using the E9 from my 92 MH 15 spd fuller tranny and a suspenion and rears from a 2000 Ch hendrickson air ride and eaton rears 3:90 with hub pilot wheels. My 866 I ran 6 ft 6" pipes mounted on frame mounted brackets behind the cab. There's pics of it with that exhaust in my gallery pics if you want to have a look.