Mack Technician Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 (edited) I think I got them for about $8 per kit from PAI. If you get delta seal upgrade they are more expensive. no call for delta seal unless seeing fuel in oil. Edited November 1, 2017 by Mack Technician Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mack Technician Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 (edited) If you do pull them cross swap #5 to a hole that is easiest to access. See if the code moves to the different hole. If next week you pop a new cylinder position you've caught your trouble maker red handed. I'd run six months and if no codes popped anywhere x-install the cal codes from 5 to wherever and vise versa. Record codes during swap if you can still see them. Edited November 1, 2017 by Mack Technician Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mackpro Posted November 2, 2017 Share Posted November 2, 2017 if 2000CL713 had a code reader and could tell us the FMI it would help. If FMI is 8, I'd keep driving. FMI 8 is abnormal frequency response. This usually happens at cold start up and goes away as engine warms. Once or twice a week = ok. Every day then change EUP. If FMI is other than 8 then EUP or harness issues 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2000CL713 Posted November 2, 2017 Author Share Posted November 2, 2017 i dont have a code reader for the truck. in the almost 10 years iv owned it i can probably count all the times the malfunction light has come on, on one hand and still have fingers left lol its VERY rare. it only showed this code that one day for a bit and never again. if the EUP is mechanically failing or showing wear signs like the pictures posted will the light still come on? thats the reason i wanted to check them all so i can visually inspect them. my worry is one letting go and fucking something else up turning a $300 fix into a $3000 fix. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fjh Posted November 2, 2017 Share Posted November 2, 2017 If Your going to up root them pumps Buy NEW bOLTS, ( usually ) the code has nothing to do with a worn or mechanical failure ie: flat or worn roller broken spring! ! also try and get it as clean as you can behind the pumps before you pull em! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirtymilkman Posted November 2, 2017 Share Posted November 2, 2017 1 hour ago, fjh said: If Your going to up root them pumps Buy NEW bOLTS, ( usually ) the code has nothing to do with a worn or mechanical failure ie: flat or worn roller broken spring! ! also try and get it as clean as you can behind the pumps before you pull em! Perfect advise. Pull stainless shields off and wash everything. Also a great time to run a new fuel return line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mack Technician Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 (edited) Historically we first have a miss if it is base metal dying in an EUP hole. Code is generally a pulse magnet, but can accompany a miss. Has a lot to do with the OEM software. I've replaced a dozen EUPs on the Liehberrr for mechanical or magnet fails, but have never, to date, got a code, only a run issue. Mack was more sensitive by far. It's never a bad idea to check your EUPs when your over 10K hours. The pic I have attached was from a 15K engine. 2 of 6 cylinders had broken EUP springs, the one which broke a second time took out the cam because it unloaded the roller from the cam. One crack keeps the load, but when #2 comes it's over. Pulled a lot of broken springs out of Mack engines. You likely will not find your code issue in the hole of the EUP or inspecting and you could introduce dirt if your not careful. I would only inspect them in the case of engine age, off season downtime, free labor and because Pre EGR engines are real nice to work on. Edited November 3, 2017 by Mack Technician Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ezrider Posted November 4, 2017 Share Posted November 4, 2017 i think i am going to be needing to change a few more eup's soon. i recently had a miss and other issues that was 3 square eup rollers a toasted cam shaft and 2 bad eup's now #3 is coding out at least once per day and #6 every few days. truck is still running good pulls 28-30psi of boost under max load and is running strong. but only about 30k miles after a cam makes me a little nervous...lol. hoping to maybe get around to changing at least 3 and 6 here in the next few weeks if i don't decide to just do the 4 that were not just replaced. as long as its not another toasted cam shaft i am happy...lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fjh Posted November 4, 2017 Share Posted November 4, 2017 22 hours ago, Mack Technician said: Historically we first have a miss if it is base metal dying in an EUP hole. Code is generally a pulse magnet, but can accompany a miss. Has a lot to do with the OEM software. I've replaced a dozen EUPs on the Liehberrr for mechanical or magnet fails, but have never, to date, got a code, only a run issue. Mack was more sensitive by far. It's never a bad idea to check your EUPs when your over 10K hours. The pic I have attached was from a 15K engine. 2 of 6 cylinders had broken EUP springs, the one which broke a second time took out the cam because it unloaded the roller from the cam. One crack keeps the load, but when #2 comes it's over. Pulled a lot of broken springs out of Mack engines. You likely will not find your code issue in the hole of the EUP or inspecting and you could introduce dirt if your not careful. I would only inspect them in the case of engine age, off season downtime, free labor and because Pre EGR engines are real nice to work on. Yup its to bad they don't build em like the CL any more they probably Fired the the engineers who designed it, for making it TOO EASY to work on! THE ERA of the STAND UP OIL CHANGE went away when the CL -CH and the E7/ first ETeck were done! Real sad to see!If I was ever to be looking for a truck to buy it would be a CL OR ch with an ETECK or E7 18 sp fuller in it of this era Fricking awesome!! The ultimate! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mackpro Posted November 4, 2017 Share Posted November 4, 2017 I did a cam job on a 1994 E7 today. I like the old trucks ! Yep , stand up oil/filter change! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BidRedUgly Posted December 20, 2017 Share Posted December 20, 2017 2007 CHN613. AC380/410. Is there some trick to getting the upper O-rings to seal in the block to prevent fuel from weeping down the outside of the block? I pulled all six of mine in sequence and replaced the O-rings. When I did that, I cleaned the grooves (upper and lower) and oiled the groove and installed the O-rings making sure they weren’t twisted. I applied a thin coat of oil to the top of the bore and the O-rings and reinstalled. I used a barring tool to rotate the engine, and using new bolts, I ran them down evenly on both sides of the unit pump. Still have the same fuel leakage issue that I had before new O-rings. Thoughts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mack Technician Posted December 20, 2017 Share Posted December 20, 2017 22 minutes ago, BidRedUgly said: 2007 CHN613. AC380/410. Is there some trick to getting the upper O-rings to seal in the block to prevent fuel from weeping down the outside of the block? I pulled all six of mine in sequence and replaced the O-rings. When I did that, I cleaned the grooves (upper and lower) and oiled the groove and installed the O-rings making sure they weren’t twisted. I applied a thin coat of oil to the top of the bore and the O-rings and reinstalled. I used a barring tool to rotate the engine, and using new bolts, I ran them down evenly on both sides of the unit pump. Still have the same fuel leakage issue that I had before new O-rings. Thoughts? Are all of them leaking??? Or just the original leakers still leaking? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BidRedUgly Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 They all were and still after the new O-rings, which is why I question my methods. I made sure the bores were clean before (no residue on the bore walls of any kind) I re-installed the EUPs. It took a few days, but they all started showing signs of fuel on the block. 2007 CHN613. AC380/410. Is there some trick to getting the upper O-rings to seal in the block to prevent fuel from weeping down the outside of the block? I pulled all six of mine in sequence and replaced the O-rings. When I did that, I cleaned the grooves (upper and lower) and oiled the groove and installed the O-rings making sure they weren’t twisted. I applied a thin coat of oil to the top of the bore and the O-rings and reinstalled. I used a barring tool to rotate the engine, and using new bolts, I ran them down evenly on both sides of the unit pump. Still have the same fuel leakage issue that I had before new O-rings. Thoughts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mackpro Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 Could be the solinod pack/ magnet o-ring onthe EUP leaking. They make a o-ring kit for this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mackpro Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 (edited) Trying to attach service bulletin Edited December 21, 2017 by Mackpro Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirtymilkman Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 I had my small fuel return line leaking and it would weep around the unit pumps. It looked just like the pumps were leaking up out the top. That little line pulses a lot and will rub through. It also gets brittle after awhile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mackpro Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 http://hr.mckenzietank.com/maint/bulletins/44-sb221030.pdf 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mack Technician Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 (edited) Got my vote on upper EUP kit. You installed everything right. Think laterally and away from the block-fit O-rings. Edited December 21, 2017 by Mack Technician 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BidRedUgly Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 Supposedly all these unit pumps were reman units not long before I bought the truck. It sounds like a dentist mirror and a little investigative action is the order of the day! Thanks for all the help, guys. I will let you know what I find. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mackpro Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 As mentioned earlier, they make a special lower o-ring for fuel in oil but nothing for the upper o-ring, http://hr.mckenzietank.com/maint/bulletins/42-sb221038.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BidRedUgly Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 Ok. So I got the seal kits installed on all the EUPs. As I said earlier, they were all supposedly new remans when I got the truck. I've only put on about 50,000 mi. Since April. Most of the seals removed were pretty stiff, not pliable like new ones are. Without fail, every backer plate on the rear of each EUP was wet on the inside. I'm assuming (and hoping) that means the round o-ring under the 'plug' was leaking on each one which would weep fuel around each EUP from the rear making it look like the upper bore o-ring was leaking. I won't have any results until after Christmas when I'm back out, but this is what I've found, so far. Thanks again for the suggestions. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BidRedUgly Posted July 10, 2018 Share Posted July 10, 2018 Sorry I took so long to reply with results. Okay. One more R&R of the EUPs later and the fuel leakage has stopped. The deck was still getting wet around the EUPs but no fuel smell anymore. Culprit? Exhaust manifold studs. I discovered a broken one causing an exhaust leak, so while repairing I pulled the others and replaced using hi-temp RTV to seal the lowers due to the partial thru-bore of the stud bore (per service bulletin). The engine is now dry as a popcorn fart! Thanks for all the help 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vision 618 Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 I know this is 2 years later but I'm responding for others that might find this thread. Www.thedieselstore.com has the mack unit pumps for $265. Other sites and Mack want $450-500. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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