CH Cab Replacement

[Red Horse]

Saw a post on another site that Alkane will soon add a class 8 cab over to their US "production".  Can't see how this company can make a go of it.  Establishing a US factory, dealer organization, importing Chinese cabs, using US components and doing all this under the premise that alternative fuels (CNG -LPG- LNG) are the cornerstone of their business.

Any opinions? for sure KSC-what does your crystal ball say?

[Red Horse]

Was taking plant tour at Macungie yesterday and asked young guy (graduate engineer who works in plant in some sort of QC/workflow improvement capacity) what about "new cab".  He said it would be existing cab with "some improvements"-or words to that effect.  Bottom line he was specific that it was not a new Volvo cab.  He did say they were going to eliminate a paint booth line to expand the refuse truck build line and that the cabs would now go from cab supplier to Volvo New River where they would be painted and THEN sent to Macungie.

Seems like a lot of handling to me.  

How about it KSC -any thoughts?

[kscarbel2]

11 hours ago, Red Horse said:

Was taking plant tour at Macungie yesterday and asked young guy (graduate engineer who works in plant in some sort of QC/workflow improvement capacity) what about "new cab".  He said it would be existing cab with "some improvements"-or words to that effect.  Bottom line he was specific that it was not a new Volvo cab.  He did say they were going to eliminate a paint booth line to expand the refuse truck build line and that the cabs would now go from cab supplier to Volvo New River where they would be painted and THEN sent to Macungie.

Seems like a lot of handling to me.  

How about it KSC -any thoughts?

The CH was officially launched for model year 1988. Based on that date, the cab is 28 years old.

But as Terry Warmkessel will tell you, in those days, we typically utilized a 5-year road map to bring an all-new model to life. I that sense, the CH cab is arguably 33 years old.

The CH cab was yet another brilliant achievement of the former Mack Trucks. Hansen enthusiasm still existed during its creation.

But fast forward to year 2016. Most Mack salesmen coast-to-coast are struggling to sell Pinnacles to fleets because the driver can't stand up out of the driver's seat, as they can in the competitor's cabs, and the competition in finding/keeping good drivers is fierce.

After three decades, customers like to see something new, an all-new cab taking advantage of the latest technologies.

The new cab has really rode the rollercoaster. Just ousted Olof Persson let it languish, as he did the LE cab replacement (LR), and that is a half-hearted (cheap) effort.

In Sweden, I was told on numerous occasions the new cab would be an offshoot of the upcoming new Volvo global cab platform.

However, that was before Persson was fired and the Scania gang was brought in. Volvo is in serious financial straights. Volvo Construction is bleeding badly with no light at the end of the tunnel, having, for example, recklessly lost millions in China with bad loans. Brazil, a long-time important market for both Volvo and Scania, is in terrible shape, and low truck sales reflect that. And then the US truck market didn't merely slow down......it crashed. 

Thus, it's completely possible they will buy time by revising the CH cab roof, among other things, creating an integral raised roof with that of the sleeper. That certainly wouldn't cost much. But I doubt they'll spend the money to widen it. The engineering would be cheap, but they have to invest in new tooling.

The last time I saw the CH cab tooling, it was in terrible shape. Tooling has a lifespan. The tooling belongs to Volvo. It is consigned to CVG to use.....they produce the cab under contract. Volvo didn't want to spend any meaningful money on tooling refurbishment. Unless something has changed, the remaining life of that tooling is short.

http://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/39183-source-of-mack-cabs/

If Volvo plans to truck the cabs 180 miles from King's Mountain to Dublin, paint them there, and "then" truck them the other 420 miles to Macungie.........no comment.

Why not create jobs in Pennsylvania (the laid off Macungie workers that Volvo claims to care about) by assembling, painting and grooming the cabs at a Volvo-owned satellite facility adjacent to the Macungie plant (you know, where most are utilized).

 

[kscarbel2]

8 hours ago, Red Horse said:

Saw a post on another site that Alkane will soon add a class 8 cab over to their US "production".  Can't see how this company can make a go of it.  Establishing a US factory, dealer organization, importing Chinese cabs, using US components and doing all this under the premise that alternative fuels (CNG -LPG- LNG) are the cornerstone of their business.

Any opinions? for sure KSC-what does your crystal ball say?

Bob Smith and Steve Rayborn are good people. But they have zero chance at successfully selling the class 8 COE Chinese Foton in the US market. It's a conventional cab market. China has some world class trucks now, but Fotons (GTL) is barely in that group.

And, of course, the natural gas truck market has collapsed in the US, as it has in China, due to low-priced diesel.

Alkane's business model depends on subsidies.

[41chevy]

7 minutes ago, kscarbel2 said:

Bob Smith and Steve Rayborn are good people. But they have zero chance at successfully selling the class 8 COE Chinese Foton in the US market. It's a conventional cab market. China has some world class trucks now, but Fotons (GTL) is barely in that group.

And, of course, the natural gas truck market has collapsed in the US, as it has in China, due to low-priced diesel.

Alkane's business model depends on subsidies.

Were they attempting to set up with GM  for their sales and services? I thought I read that in your original article.    Paul

[kscarbel2]

Just now, 41chevy said:

Were they attempting to set up with GM  for their sales and services? I thought I read that in your original article.    Paul

I have not heard that from them.

[41chevy]

7 minutes ago, kscarbel2 said:

I have not heard that from them.

I stand corrected GM based 6.0 and 8.8 liter V-8 engines built to run on LPG or CNG

[kscarbel2]

4 minutes ago, 41chevy said:

I stand corrected GM based 6.0 and 8.8 liter V-8 engines built to run on LPG or CNG

Yes, they use GM-based PSI engines, and the Cummins-Westport ISX12 G.

http://www.psiengines.com/whatwedo/on-highway-engines/

 

[RoadwayR]

Wan't the CH cab recently revised?  Thought they made it a bit longer.  Wish they would go back to the original doors, I never liked Ford Super Duty the look of the dipped beltline. 

[Dirtymilkman]

1 hour ago, RoadwayR said:

Wan't the CH cab recently revised?  Thought they made it a bit longer.  Wish they would go back to the original doors, I never liked Ford Super Duty the look of the dipped beltline. 

More like copy of the Kenworth "daylight door"  I do love the visibility out of them and I don't miss the smokers windows.

[rsb502]

the "new Mack Cab came out in 07 production, it grew 3 or 4" longer for more leg room, the dash and all the interior was revamped.  I like the newer Pinnacle/Granite can=b myself, I don't see a need for a wider cab, I don't know about everybody else but when I'm driving a truck I don't need to walk laps around the cab.  The open cab roof would be a nice addition to the high rise sleeper cab, being able to stand up and walk to the bunk which again, doesn't need to be 10' away.  Actually if you look at recent truck purchasing trends most trucking companies are going for smaller mid roof sleepers for regional work since the long haul is moving more and more towards containerization or intermodal.  I have heard the old trucker arguments of the railroad taking their jobs away hauling containers across country and I have pulled containers myself and I can say this, there is just as much or more trucking to do on shorter regional or local runs getting those containers to and from the shipper consignee.  I see the shift to local and regional work as a win win for trucking really, you can be home and sleep in your own bed more often than long haul, you can use a cheaper smaller or no sleeper truck...thus the rise in used daycab prices and I actually made more money doing several shirt hauls than I ever did long haul.  That being said add a high rise roof to the high rise sleeper model and leave it alone.

[Red Horse]

10 hours ago, rsb502 said:

the "new Mack Cab came out in 07 production, it grew 3 or 4" longer for more leg room, the dash and all the interior was revamped.  I like the newer Pinnacle/Granite can=b myself, I don't see a need for a wider cab, I don't know about everybody else but when I'm driving a truck I don't need to walk laps around the cab.  The open cab roof would be a nice addition to the high rise sleeper cab, being able to stand up and walk to the bunk which again, doesn't need to be 10' away.  Actually if you look at recent truck purchasing trends most trucking companies are going for smaller mid roof sleepers for regional work since the long haul is moving more and more towards containerization or intermodal.  I have heard the old trucker arguments of the railroad taking their jobs away hauling containers across country and I have pulled containers myself and I can say this, there is just as much or more trucking to do on shorter regional or local runs getting those containers to and from the shipper consignee.  I see the shift to local and regional work as a win win for trucking really, you can be home and sleep in your own bed more often than long haul, you can use a cheaper smaller or no sleeper truck...thus the rise in used daycab prices and I actually made more money doing several shirt hauls than I ever did long haul.  That being said add a high rise roof to the high rise sleeper model and leave it alone.

I'm with you on the wider cab issue.  Also agree 100% that the"large car" market is going downhill as intermodal gains ground-I've posted this thought  many times on this site as well as the Ford Blue Oval News site with respect to Ford getting back into class 8.  The future will be in the regional day cab tractor and you don't need 600 HP and a two story sleeper to do that.   

Oh and RoadwayR's comment on the drop down window sill, I myself like that feature-be it on a Ford  or a Mack or whatever-adds a little more visibility and a nice look-again-a personal preference- and since Ford first did it-a most copied look.