Oso2 Posted March 17, 2013 Share Posted March 17, 2013 I'm new to this forum, but from what I've seen there's not a great deal of love for Volvo here. In particular, no one's crazy about shared parts.But my question is this: in what ways do Mack and Volvo's differ? They share the same engine (but different programming - which is important), the same auto transmission, and from what I've read, 60/% of the frame. So what does Mack do differently - or better?The one big area is the cab. I've never driven a Mack, but I have sat in them. I have driven a Volvo, and I consider it to be one of the most well thought-out driver-friendly cabs on the market. Ergonomics, visibility, storage - the Volvo does pretty well. I still prefer the look of the Mack dash though.BTW, I once went shopping for a truck at a Volvo/Mack dealer. The salesmen told me that, dollar for dollar, you get more out of a Volvo. (i.e. driver-side airbag.)So tell me - where does Mack shine? Build quality? Toughness? Engine programming? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2stacksuperdog Posted March 17, 2013 Share Posted March 17, 2013 Mack has a bulldog and camelback springs. Quote Matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rsb502 Posted March 17, 2013 Share Posted March 17, 2013 Mack comes out on top in vocational use, Mack transmissions and rear ends are some of the strongest available and the Mack camelback rear suspension was so good as designed it has barely been changed in over 50 years. Volvo makes a quiet comfortable highway truck but everyone I've known to try them in heavy use has gone back to Mack or KW asap, it's just a different way of doing things. With a Mack pedigreed drive train you go to one place and deal with one company for everything from the front to the back and always have, other oem's like Volvo are getting there now but there about 100 years late to that party. In short Mack sets up their engine programming to get the low rpm high torque rise for vocational work, then has their transmission and their gear ratios in Mack double reduction rears that are all matched for the best possible operation. I will say this Mack started designing their trans/rear gear ratios around their engines way back in the early 1900's and now they are having to set the engines to Mack gear ratios, kinda flipped. 1 Quote "Any Society that would give up a little LIBERTY to gain a little SECURITY will Deserve Neither and LOSE BOTH" -Benjamin Franklin"If your gonna be STUPID, you gotta be TOUGH" "You cant always get what you want, but if you try sometimes you get what you need" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GearheadGrrrl Posted March 17, 2013 Share Posted March 17, 2013 Depends on the specs- It is possible to spec a CX and a Volvo that are near identical but for the cab. That said, the MR and LE are still pretty much Mack designs, never having been switched over to the Volvo chassis. It's also possible to spec a real Mack triple countershaft transmission, double reduction axles, and bogie, though many Mack salespeople will try to talk you out of it. But the handwriting is on the wall- the Mack conventional cab has been around for over two decades now and will ultimately get replaced with a Volvo cab, and I doubt Volvo will tolerate the boxy MR and LE cabs forever when they have something more sexy from Renault to offer... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oso2 Posted March 17, 2013 Author Share Posted March 17, 2013 But the handwriting is on the wall- the Mack conventional cab has been around for over two decades now and will ultimately get replaced with a Volvo cabYeah, but as I said, the cab is the weakest part of a Mack (as a tall guy I'm not impressed with the visibility.) Mind you, KW and Petebilt have managed to share parts without losing identity. I see no reason why Volvo/Mack shouldn't do the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REOGasMackDiesel Posted March 17, 2013 Share Posted March 17, 2013 KW and Pete are both Paccar's, Chevy and GMC are both General Motors,the difference is GMC/CHEVY-KW/PETE are operated as the same entity where Mack and Volvo have remained legally separate. Same as Fiat and Chrysler, Yep one owns the other but are ran as 2 different companys. Mack Defense was split off into its own operation. Same as Fiat did with RAM after buying Chrysler.Fiat and Chrysler share technology and have done some badge engineering they also have plenty of their own separate designs and products.Now my father used to say that most commercial trucks were bought based on how the body looked and price offered. To him they were all Mechanically the same trucks except Mack and a few IH's though they could be optionally offered the same too. I think that has become even more true in the modern day trucks, Every brand can have X engine with Z transmission, and Y rear ends. So Mack has now sorta joined the crowd more so than they once were is all.Just how I see it anyway . . .Mike Quote 1953 REO M48.1962 GMC 3000.1969 AMC AMX-390.1983 AMC Eagle SX/4.1988 AMC Jeep Comanche. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rsb502 Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Yeah, but as I said, the cab is the weakest part of a Mack (as a tall guy I'm not impressed with the visibility.) Mind you, KW and Petebilt have managed to share parts without losing identity. I see no reason why Volvo/Mack shouldn't do the same.Have you Been in a newer +4 cab, hell I'm over 6'1" and all leg and I manage to keep the seat off the wall with no air in it. I know a lot of people think bad things about Mack when they think about comfort but the truth is they have come a long way since the B model. 1 Quote "Any Society that would give up a little LIBERTY to gain a little SECURITY will Deserve Neither and LOSE BOTH" -Benjamin Franklin"If your gonna be STUPID, you gotta be TOUGH" "You cant always get what you want, but if you try sometimes you get what you need" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oso2 Posted March 18, 2013 Author Share Posted March 18, 2013 (edited) Have you Been in a newer +4 cab, hell I'm over 6'1" and all leg and I manage to keep the seat off the wall with no air in it. I know a lot of people think bad things about Mack when they think about comfort but the truth is they have come a long way since the B model.Yeah, I've been in a couple of new Pinnacles. The ergonomics & space are fine, but it feels like the windows are mounted too low. I imagine that it would be hard(er) to see traffic lights and anything else that is high up.Also, the base Volvo has more storage space around the dash, headliner and doors. If nothing else I really wish that Mack would adopt the Volvo 'lip' on top of the dash - it makes for a really useful place to store things that you need to grab in a hurry: pens, snacks, customs papers, etc. I do like that new headliner that I've seen in the daycabs - I wonder if it's available on the sleeper version? But overall I think that Mack should have put a little more thought into driver amenities. It would make a world of difference. Edited March 18, 2013 by ajoso Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2stacksuperdog Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Don't forget Mack is Mack and Volvo is Volvo for now. By Mack adopting Volvo cab features it would be thus show their dominance over mack and making it look like Mack engineers don't know what they're doing Quote Matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
staxx Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 If they want to do a new cab they need to bring back a new version of the MH cabover. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REOGasMackDiesel Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Don't forget Mack is Mack and Volvo is Volvo for now. By Mack adopting Volvo cab features it would be thus show their dominance over mack and making it look like Mack engineers don't know what they're doing This what I have trying to say, They are currently running both brands as separate items with a few minor shared items.Mike Quote 1953 REO M48.1962 GMC 3000.1969 AMC AMX-390.1983 AMC Eagle SX/4.1988 AMC Jeep Comanche. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rsb502 Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Windows are too low? Cant see lights? Let some air outta that seat driver your gonna get a concussion! Quote "Any Society that would give up a little LIBERTY to gain a little SECURITY will Deserve Neither and LOSE BOTH" -Benjamin Franklin"If your gonna be STUPID, you gotta be TOUGH" "You cant always get what you want, but if you try sometimes you get what you need" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
staxx Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Must be one of those drivers that wears flip flops and thinks being called a steering wheel holder the high lite of his career , sorry but mack is for a higher class drivers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
storkmack Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 I have never understood the"lack of storage/ small cab" thing. I have always had the pleasure to drive an R-model to make a living. Things I need on daily basis fit in a 12x18 Rubbermaid container that sits on the floor in front of the passenger seat. The lunch box sits between the seats. Any thing related to straps, tools, etc. go in the saddle box mounted to the frame behind the passenger side fuel tank. My biggest question those who think the cab isn't big enough is this, what the hell are you doing in there? -Brad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REOGasMackDiesel Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 What's the deal here ? ! "Maore storage" "bigger cabs" ? ! If you want a Cadillac go buy one ! Mack's are about creature comforts they are all about getting the job done. You would of been the farm bought tractors with cab's ! Mike 1 Quote 1953 REO M48.1962 GMC 3000.1969 AMC AMX-390.1983 AMC Eagle SX/4.1988 AMC Jeep Comanche. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kscarbel Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 Don't forget Mack is Mack and Volvo is Volvo for now. By Mack adopting Volvo cab features it would be thus show their dominance over mack and making it look like Mack engineers don't know what they're doingI think it must be realized that there are no more Mack engineers. Mack Trucks was acquired by Volvo in 2000 and is now a Volvo Group "brand" (and nothing more). The American icon truckmaker Mack Trucks no longer exists.Every engineer receives a paycheck from Volvo Trucks North America.Every engineer has a Volvo e-mail address (e.g. john.smith@volvo.com).Thus the sad truth be told, Mack-branded Volvo North American market trucks are designed by Volvo engineers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oso2 Posted March 19, 2013 Author Share Posted March 19, 2013 (edited) I have never understood the"lack of storage/ small cab" thing. I have always had the pleasure to drive an R-model to make a living. Things I need on daily basis fit in a 12x18 Rubbermaid container that sits on the floor in front of the passenger seat. The lunch box sits between the seats. Any thing related to straps, tools, etc. go in the saddle box mounted to the frame behind the passenger side fuel tank. My biggest question those who think the cab isn't big enough is this, what the hell are you doing in there? -BradTo each his own. Some people bring CD's, books, extra clothes, dogs, microwaves, coffeemakers, guitars - whatever floats your boat. Things have changed since the 70's. The norm is now a 70" full-width condo. KW and Pete will soon be getting rid of their narrow cabs (sometime around 2014 I heard.) Good design accommodates different types of drivers and different layover requirements.Perhaps we can get back on track and talk about Mack trucks & components. How's the wiring and build quality compared to a Volvo VN? Durability? Edited March 19, 2013 by ajoso Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2stacksuperdog Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 Don't the dashes fall out of the Volvos? Our coonhound fits nice and comfy in a R-series cab. 2 Quote Matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
storkmack Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 To each his own. Some people bring CD's, books, extra clothes, dogs, microwaves, coffeemakers, guitars - whatever floats your boat. Things have changed since the 70's. The norm is now a 70" full-width condo. KW and Pete will soon be getting rid of their narrow cabs (sometime around 2014 I heard.) Good design accommodates different types of drivers and different layover requirements.Perhaps we can get back on track and talk about Mack trucks & components. How's the wiring and build quality compared to a Volvo VN? Durability?Thank you for thinking I'm a throw back to the 70's (pre-deregulation). I wasn't even a twinkle in anyone's eye at that time. I did, however, learn this trade from men that were true truck drivers. Clean, professional, and timely. They knew all aspects of thier job. They knew what thier shippers and receivers expected from them and gave them a higher level of service. The amazing thing was that most of them did it fom a cabover with less than 300 hp. The drivers of today sure are different. That being said, the Volvos I have been around seem to have decent wiring harnesses and fairly clean frame rails compared to a Freightliner or IH. I have seen Volvos with badly rusted, to the point of holes, frames. It all boils down to what fits the type of work you do, and your personal preference. -Brad 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
41180 Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 i think mack and volvo are still different . they use alot of the same parts but all macks are built in macungie by mack employees some have been there for 30 yrs and they take pride in there macks and are still almost entirely hand built. you can still get the mack transmissions and rearends and suspensions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REOGasMackDiesel Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 i think mack and volvo are still different . they use alot of the same parts but all macks are built in macungie by mack employees some have been there for 30 yrs and they take pride in there macks and are still almost entirely hand built. you can still get the mack transmissions and rearends and suspensions I been saying this for a while, They don't seem to listen, or just don't care. They keep thinking as they do and the Mack brand will surely disappear all together forever too I bet.I would love to see a side by side comparison I'm sure there is more "Mack" to a Mack than these guys are giving credit for.Mike Quote 1953 REO M48.1962 GMC 3000.1969 AMC AMX-390.1983 AMC Eagle SX/4.1988 AMC Jeep Comanche. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
41180 Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 i agree. until they put volvo cabs and hoods and discontinue the mack transmissions and rears start building macks n the same factory as a volvo ill say macks are different. kscarbel gets on here and starts bad mouthing everything about volvo and new macks it gets old to me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james j neiweem Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 Kscarbel does know some shi? though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REEL ADDICTION Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 Volvo is here to stay not everyone might like it but is the truth we just have to learn to live with the change 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Challenger Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 This what I have trying to say, They are currently running both brands as separate items with a few minor shared items.MikeI wouldn't consider the engine and emissions systems minor items. Even if you have a complete Mack powertrain you have a Volvo engine, Mack trans, Mack rears built by Meritor and a gold bulldog. So in the end you have a Mack trans. Im not bad mouthing Mack, times have changed. New trucks aren't allowed to puff anymore. The gray engine days are over. The name lives on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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