fjh

My opinion the inline is more resilient! I personally like the v pump for its simplicity! And had worked more with them saw a fare few failures the in-line was only use several years at the end!

This is one of those occasions where  loose is better than too tight! Bet you need to add a  15 thou gasket  to one or both!

I would check the backlash on the pto s.  First!

joey great minds ! 😂

6 minutes ago, Joey Mack said:

hell..  I thought he had an actual clutch pedal when I answered him in another posting..    yes,,, grade gripper....  

huh didn’t see the post bro! Just saw this one 😂

Turn grade gripper off see if that affects things!

46 minutes ago, Boxler1066 said:

No boost leaks….I inspected all the piping and there is no issues with the piping and it has relatively new silicone hoses throughout the turbo piping and they all look good…no tears or abrasion damage to them…and the air to air cooler was pressure tested and that’s good…it had a new teflon lined hose from intake to air compressor inlet and that hose looks fine and II inspected the intake manifold gaskets all the way around each port with a good flashlight and seen no indication of a gasket being blown out and also sprayed ether around the intake ports while it was idling and no change in engine rpm so it doesn’t appear to have any leaks whatsoever and it had a new turbo put on it about a year ago and I pulled air cleaner pipe off recently to see if turbo felt like it had issues and it seems perfectly fine….If it’s getting too much fuel what would cause that? It has a mack reman computer put on it a couple years ago and the mack dealer programmed it given the trucks vin # and engine ID tag information….truck has a complete new wiring harness from front bumper to rear bumper… new cab, engine, transmission and chassis harness

If It’s getting too much fuel what would cause that?

the engine has considerably more blow by than normal 

I have oil pan off and all the lobes are nice and smooth… no indication of damage from a bad cam follower and same goes for eup lobes…I haven’t measured them yet with a dial indicator but I’m going to upon rebuild if I stick with keeping it a 300 to make sure it’s good

 

Bad or sticking injectors! As for boost leaks! The Best way to check for leaks is to pressure up the the whole engine ! build an and adaptor to plug off the intercooler at the turbo side! Apply  Shop air regulated to 35 psi thru the after cooler and engine  ! And turn the engine by hand till pressure starts to show on the boost gauge assuming it has one! Believe it or not! there is a point in the engine cycle the everything is closed momentarily! when you hit this point! you will find almost any leak you want to find even bloby past the rings and valve guides  you will hear from the  oil filler neck! ! Is the compressor plumbed into the intake hose ? These fail at the Joints at the hoses where they connect to the  manifold and the compressor (common failure} ! A look see is not the best way to check!In my opinion you have one of three things there , in order of importance .> a Bad boost leak , lazy turbo ,or bad injectors !however I'm not there so I can't say for sure! don't apply the parts Cannon untill you confirm the boost leak theory properly!  The lazy turbo is a tough call cause its its the most expensive and doesn't happen often ! last resort!

Just sayin!

12 hours ago, Boxler1066 said:

So the truck with the bad AI-300A engine has EUP’s and it is a 2003 Mack MR688S with an Allison…I forget now…I think it might be an HT4560…I’ll have to check to confirm that,…it  has the computer located on the passenger side up higher…. kinda about the level of the intake and water manifolds…it has no cooler lines running to it where the computer on the E7-460 I believe is located down lower and if memory serves me right I believe it has cooler lines hooked to it and the 460 also has EUP’s

So to fully explain what’s going on here is I’ve been referencing converting that AI-300A engine into an E7-460 for this reason…..we have 1999 mack RD688S with an E7-460 that we use on the farm and I decided to use the information from that E7-460 by using that trucks VIN and also engine ID tag as my reference to determine the difference between these 2 engines….I did this thinking this truck has always been good and reliable and has the extra power that I wanted our MR688 to have…..since the MR motor needs an overhaul I figured it would be a good time to convert to a higher horsepower level.   As far as the Allison and driveshafts and power train goes I don’t think it’s anything to be concerned about in this particular situation….the truck stays in the farmyard all day and never has to go down the road….basically it never really exceeds 20mph and doesn’t have to deal with any major hills or rapid acceleration or takeoff on grades or anything like that….where the lack of power is my main issue on the AI-300A motor is has to deal with the load put on the motor to run the live hydrostatic pump and motor that runs the feed mixer on the back of the truck…..this mixer is mixing up to 35,000 pounds of corn silage, haylage and grains all at once in the mixer and that takes some power…..and to get the mixer to run the optimum speed to mix the feed ration adequately the math says the engine rpm should be 1600ish rpm range while the truck is being loaded with all the feed ingredients and also around that same 1600 rpm range offloads the mixer at about the right rate…. Problem is while mixing and offloading currently I generally can’t get the motor up much past 1100-1200 rpm range all the while the truck is laboring, throwing moderate to medium black smoke stream…. air cleaner is good… fuel filters good….air to air is good and pressure tested…. no air leaks from turbo compressor outlet to cylinder heads…has a new turbo on it…. has a new fuel transfer pump running proper pressure with a new hand primer pump on transfer pump and checked for air bubbles at transfer pump inlet with a clear glass sight glass to ensure transfer pump isn’t sucking air in fuel line from fuel tank to transfer pump inlet and see no indication of air…..I did all the above listed diagnostic about a year ago and it’s getting worse….i can tell the motor is just sick and it’s tired….its had a lot of hours put on it since we bought it used and I’m not certain of its history because I don’t know that the tach, odometer or computer are original when we bought it… but its got a fair amount of blow by,….coolant in oil and it’s always been sluggish but even more so now than when we got it…I think I would have considered looking for a complete descent E7-460 atec or E7-400 atec and then rebuilt that and put it in but when you weigh it all out I don’t know I’d be much farther ahead… far as I know if I bought a used one it may have needed a cam as well or the charger and injectors etc…etc… may have had needed to be replaced upon rebuild plus all the extra work of a complete engine swap and all the little differences you always seem to come across on a swap from one model to another vs an in frame rebuild of the sick AI motor so all that kinda got me to this point

In my opinion that engine if it was fresh should easily do the job! After all your not racing it!  If it has issues  Fix the issues and leave the rest alone! Black smoke indicates lack of air or too much fuel! Have you checked for boost leaks !??? does it have a lot of blow by? For the job its doing it sounds like a lot of work to go thru to get a basic job done! When all you need to address is  address the issues IE: a set of a set of injectors or a turbo  and or some boost leaks! Whole lot cheaper and less time consuming! Also the 300 has a pretty large torque curve due to the fact that there is and Allison behind it! 460 not so much! I have seen a 427 with an Allison ! I am just thinking about time vers result here! What you purposing is doable but worth while ?????

Just saying!

1 hour ago, Barry said:

Thank you!  I made it another trip around the sun!  I just keep the lights on...you guys make the forum GREAT!!

Team effort Bro!

41 minutes ago, Joey Mack said:

The studs bolt in, and the drums are not inboard drums? I guess I'm trying to picture them. I'm sure I've handled these before, seems I took the drum and hub off as an assembly.  If you had a picture of one, I could go to my parts house and see what he stocks. 

Double flanged hub? Or the stud has a flange on it ? I have seen both setups! You will likely have to remove the hub to get the drum off to remove the studs !

Thanx for Askin Joey!  Yup  finished up this morning  I got six hours of pottering on this project including the screw up with the first Cyls! My eager apprentice and my self  managed to get it bled down with one bleeder screw couldn't get to the right hand bleeder! Theres a jumper between the two cyls with a check valves in them had trouble getting the air out of that and resetting the rods on the clys so the oil wasn't trapped But  once we got those two issues  worked out things work as they should!😁 Stops on a dime now! Didn't realize how bad it stopped before till I got both sides working!🙄 Even  took time to replace the fan belt while the machine was down !was dreading that job too ! The drive coupler was seized to the pump managed to get that with my air hammer and some help from a neighbor on the end of a long pointy  bar!🤣The belt was almost as much as the cylinders up here ! 80 bucks! 140 for two Masters! 

22 minutes ago, Mark T said:

These guys assured the owner the codes were right from the injector itself (lol)  Can you imagine if you're correct ?  Then they'd gladly add on to what would be a twelve thousand dollar bill already.  Not to mention what else didn't live through their fact finding treasure hunt.  Truck repair is out of control.

The problem is lack of experience unfortunately the books can’t replace experience!  Been there done that multiple times helps speed things up! Some one always becomes a Guinea pig at some point! These guys are start over where us guys have been already!on the ac aset these guys are reading from a book no real world experience! Rattling off a bunch of BS they know zero about! The MP engines  had a learning curve the new guys coming along are learning them and their quirks some guys just keep following the computer screen some will innovate and come up with solutions! An quicker ways to get the job done!

39 minutes ago, Mark T said:

Guy where I live here has a E Tech (pre self destructive EGR)   He took it to a diesel repair shop because the EML was on (truck ran fine)  He wa stold the light wa son because it needed 6 unit pumps and six injectors. Then they told him they needed @ $9000.00 for parts before they went ahead with the repair. He questioned them and they were adament the codes were coming from both the unit pumps and injectors themselves.  This wasn't a Mack dealer, and that was because they gave him every excuse why it'd be weeks before they could even get it in.  So now it's been running around with the light on for a couple mounths (lol)  Personally, I think the old girl needs an engine harness, point is this is one more of countless examples of what truck repair has devolved into.  

 Experience based diagnostics ! Multiple codes for all six usually evolved into a fuel transfer pump issue ! Low fuel pressure! Not always but most times!

33 minutes ago, dieselpowerstroke said:

Thanks gentlemen for your knowledge. I have a better understanding already. I will have to search for an engine manual and get one, now I want to learn about this engine for myself, just because now I KNOW they are lying to me about it.

We bought this truck from another place, a used truck dealer. Talked to the owner about it, and since this truck has so many issues, he is willing to allow us to switch it for another truck on his lot. Very unexpected of him but a very good business move to keep our business. He doesnt seem worried about our truck at all, says he will throw a used engine in it and it wont be a problem to resell. So when the Volvo/Mack dealer is done dicking around with the truck, we will pay their stupid bill, throw an absolute fit at them armed with the knowledge you guys have given me, then go swap the truck out with the used truck place. Might try a different brand this time.

Thank you very much for all your input everyone, I very much appreciate it! Im sure this thread will help someone else in the future! Whenever they get the truck done, i will let you guys know what BS they try to feed me on the way out of the shop.

Well At the very least you have learned where not to take a truck for repairs! ANY TRUCK!  Can't imagine what they would have told you had you brought them a Pete with a Cat or Cummins engine in it for repairs!🙄May be they would have you change out the Air in the Tires or something@ 150 an hour ! 

Sorry this Happened to you! Not all Mack dealers Are like this How ever now a days its hard to find reputable people to work !

You'll  see multiple complaints on this site By a lot of us on this subject!

Good luck with your truck hunting Bro!

The whole deal stinks  of BS !

Volvo brain! They are trying to baffle you with BS ! Just sayin! 
Don’t know what else to say! I have nothing good to say so I won’t!

AI B.S. Click Bait!

There are lots of tsb on this subject ! None on F**kn injector  Cups On E7! Granted the Volvo turds screwed up the service bulletins like they did to the parts system ! probably hid them some place!  Now I think on it these guys where his truck is fit right in !😡

3 minutes ago, Joey Mack said:

So what's your point ??  Don't hold back, FJH...

I'm Sad that there are Shops that impersonate being Mack dealers some times! but that goes with this generation of people that have No integrity No concept of pride in workmanship ! Is Just a sad state of affairs ! Depressing to See!  

14 hours ago, Joey Mack said:

I have been able to re-use those injector lines.  I take a small piece of 320 emery cloth in my finger tips and rotate the ends of the lines until the impression is all but gone.  theres been many times where all 6 stayed sealed..  NO o-rings or sealant is used,,  EVER...   they dont leak oil, if they did you will have a bigger issue..  Buddy,  I dont like to pick on mechanics, but I get the impression they dont know Mack engines..  I suggest you search out some other posts on here related to your issue, and read them..   with respect, Jojo

Get The Truck out of that shop ! The more I read the more I believe you need to RUN! THEY ARE CLUE LESS! and full of BS!

as Joey Said !  ok...  too much to absorb..  stop them, and pull the truck home..   the injector cups on those engines dont crack. 

I have seen over the whole time I worked on these!  injector(sleeves) not cups leak MAYBE twice and never internal !And apparently you have Two leaking NOPE Don't think so ! Get the truck out of that shop! They are not real Mack oriented they got Volvo brain! I have seen where the wrong sleeve was installed in the wrong head  coolant leaked out the injector line! These can be replaced in frame IF they are leaking! But they aren't! Injection lines leak yup Fuel ! Tow the truck it would be wise to get the hell out of there tow it to joeys if you have to It will be a way cheaper and it would get fixed proper! And another thing I would suggest if you have disturbed the rocker assemblies replace the bolts there were issues at one time with these and you want to start fresh there ! Joey will likely get get you talked thru the coolant push thing here! another embellishment I read was High liners That never happened either! low liners in the early engines yup ! but not on AI or AC Get the truck out of there!  this engine wasn't One of Macks stellar builds but it didn't have any injector sleeve issues to speak of! They were guilty of trying to make it Eat Its  own shit just like all the rest due to the emission rules! extra heat to deal with bla bla bla !  

Yup Joey will take that 😂

19 minutes ago, Joey Mack said:

I have a Jabobs svc kit withe enough parts to rebuild 2 Jake heads.. 

Injector orings was another one I used to horde them when V8s were popular! We did head gaskets by the dozen for several years till they finally got a good handle on the gasket issue! 😁 I tend to pack rat stuff anyway, Might need that some day ! You know!🙄

10 hours ago, mowerman said:

Open the surprise me they’re really cracking down here in Reno. What surprises make us? This place is turned into most every other town. They are really cracking down on ID at least that’s what they’re saying on the main street media. Let’s see what happens…. Bob

its  hard to believe anything you see electronically these days with this AI Crap going on! They tell you one thing and the exact opposite is going on or worse!  This post could be fake for all I know! 😡

15 hours ago, Joey Mack said:

I dug through all my small Mack parts and only found 2 straight keys..  This is how they get us..  Make essential small parts obsolete.  I wish I had a crystal ball 10 + years ago..  I may have bought a few of them, as well as other smalls..  Mack's price is $85.00..   I saw a PAI version for $103.00..  None in stock..

I used to squirrel away various parts in my tool box bottom drawer that our parts guys seemed to have a hard time getting saving them from rebuild kits ect,  Trunnion inner washers was a common save as not every job was worth using them! 

13 hours ago, Joey Mack said:

UHhh,,  this posting is 9 years old guy's....   🤣

yup noticed after i posted ! 🤣