Full Floater Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 (edited) In search of a better way to set injection timing. I'm working on 2, 237's. Both with Ambac pumps. One with a fresh rebuild pump and another with a used pump swapped from another engine. Both engine data plates read 26 degrees at port closing. I have spilled timed both of them, to as close to 26 degrees as I could manage. Both engines are running good and sounding good. However, both engines smoke quite a bit of blue (unburnt fuel) at an idle, especially when cold. They clear up once i've got my foot into it under load. The injectors are also fresh rebuilds so it's unlikely that the spray pattern is poor. And neither engine uses much oil or has much blow by. So...I figure my spill timing is out a couple degrees, probably retarded. instead of pulling the delivery valves a few more times and messing around rotating the engine with the hard to reach crank pulley on the Western model R's; I would like to try the pulse type/clamp on timing adapter with a strobe light. I have a Snap-on and use it on other model engines, no problem. I haven't tried it yet on the Macks. If I clamp this to #1 injector tube, and read the mark on the crank when illuminated by the probe, should I expect to see the actual injection timing illuminated at an idle speed, or at a certain RPM? I know some engines with an advance mechanism in the pump (like some of the Roosa Master style Stanadyne pumps) require the engine to be at 2000rpm to accurately set timing. Edited June 22 by Full Floater Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/75696-e6-setting-injection-timing-via-pulse-adapter/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post fjh Posted June 22 Popular Post Share Posted June 22 Sorry bro I have never used the timing tool you speak of!I have on Ambac always set them by spill or blow ! I remove the delivery valve set close to the desired number and then back up the engine a tad then pull it back to to check the set! I ran into this once on a v8 the pump shop swore it was to be set at 19 I could not make it clean up after trying several times! I finally got pissed off an set it to 22 which made it run clean an pull good! I blow time ! (A rubber hose on the inlet of the pump) not sure how you’re doing it! I suggest you jump the timing up the way you’re doing it ,three degrees or so and see if it helps things! Some of the older engines went as high as 30 degrees! just me! 3 Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/75696-e6-setting-injection-timing-via-pulse-adapter/#findComment-577915 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Full Floater Posted June 22 Author Share Posted June 22 13 hours ago, fjh said: Sorry bro I have never used the timing tool you speak of!I have on Ambac always set them by spill or blow ! I remove the delivery valve set close to the desired number and then back up the engine a tad then pull it back to to check the set! I ran into this once on a v8 the pump shop swore it was to be set at 19 I could not make it clean up after trying several times! I finally got pissed off an set it to 22 which made it run clean an pull good! I blow time ! (A rubber hose on the inlet of the pump) not sure how you’re doing it! I suggest you jump the timing up the way you’re doing it ,three degrees or so and see if it helps things! Some of the older engines went as high as 30 degrees! just me! Thanks. Ya I have an aux electric lift pump on the supply side of the injection pump (on a manual toggle switch, to use for emergency side of the road priming) and it works great for spill timing. I will try to fiddle with a timing light on it and i'll report back with results. 1 Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/75696-e6-setting-injection-timing-via-pulse-adapter/#findComment-577926 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fjh Posted June 22 Share Posted June 22 1 hour ago, Full Floater said: Thanks. Ya I have an aux electric lift pump on the supply side of the injection pump (on a manual toggle switch, to use for emergency side of the road priming) and it works great for spill timing. I will try to fiddle with a timing light on it and i'll report back with results. Yup that would be interesting too know ! That type of pulse timing set up is meant for timing on the fly by turning the pump I believe! Can’t see it being helpful other than not removing the delivery valve! Be alright to check accuracy I would guess! I get the hassle on the RS rad is dam close to the damper on these where the RD the rad is lifted! Good access to the crank bolt! 1 Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/75696-e6-setting-injection-timing-via-pulse-adapter/#findComment-577933 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post glenbjackson Posted June 22 Popular Post Share Posted June 22 Gonna try on my lines tonight or tomorrow. Hope this helps 2 1 Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/75696-e6-setting-injection-timing-via-pulse-adapter/#findComment-577946 Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrsmackpaul Posted June 23 Share Posted June 23 Wont tjis br only accurate to the width of the magnetic strip ? I don't know anything about this at all, but from what I can see above it reads off a bit of magnet that must stuck onto the crank by the looks So I'm thinking it must read as the magnet passes, the longer the magnet it is the less accurate the spot is ? Would this be correct ? Also if this is correct, the bigger the diameter the magnet is stuck to the more accurate it will be ? So I'm thinking the flywheel may be the spot to measure from Paul Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/75696-e6-setting-injection-timing-via-pulse-adapter/#findComment-577980 Share on other sites More sharing options...
mowerman Posted June 23 Share Posted June 23 thats where my timing marks are,,,bob Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/75696-e6-setting-injection-timing-via-pulse-adapter/#findComment-577989 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Full Floater Posted 21 hours ago Author Popular Post Share Posted 21 hours ago Well I got it to work. Pulse adapter on cyl# 1 injection line and timing light set at 0 degrees, will give a pulse illumination at the crank dampener at the current injection timing. I was illuminating 21-22ish degrees upon initial check. This engine is a 26 degree engine. (this was after spill timing as close as I could, but I felt that it was a little retarded due do some blue exhaust haze at idle and most notable when cold) Shut it off and moved the pump flange counter clockwise a couple times till I got it smack on 26 degrees. No more blue haze. So either I didn't spill time it correctly or the spill timing is not quite as accurate as it could/should be. But Im happy to be able to check and adjust timing, without removing an injection line/delivery valve, as this way is just less invasive and quicker. 3 Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/75696-e6-setting-injection-timing-via-pulse-adapter/#findComment-579258 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fjh Posted 19 hours ago Share Posted 19 hours ago 1 hour ago, Full Floater said: Well I got it to work. Pulse adapter on cyl# 1 injection line and timing light set at 0 degrees, will give a pulse illumination at the crank dampener at the current injection timing. I was illuminating 21-22ish degrees upon initial check. This engine is a 26 degree engine. (this was after spill timing as close as I could, but I felt that it was a little retarded due do some blue exhaust haze at idle and most notable when cold) Shut it off and moved the pump flange counter clockwise a couple times till I got it smack on 26 degrees. No more blue haze. So either I didn't spill time it correctly or the spill timing is not quite as accurate as it could/should be. But Im happy to be able to check and adjust timing, without removing an injection line/delivery valve, as this way is just less invasive and quicker. Good news Floater I’m glad you tried it! Another trick in the hand book! Descent find!👍 1 Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/75696-e6-setting-injection-timing-via-pulse-adapter/#findComment-579263 Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrsmackpaul Posted 14 hours ago Share Posted 14 hours ago That is good news Spill timing is fairly good but like using a set of feeler guages or calipers, it's a fairly individual thing Great news it worked for you Paul 1 Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/75696-e6-setting-injection-timing-via-pulse-adapter/#findComment-579273 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Full Floater Posted 6 hours ago Author Share Posted 6 hours ago 7 hours ago, mrsmackpaul said: That is good news Spill timing is fairly good but like using a set of feeler guages or calipers, it's a fairly individual thing Great news it worked for you Paul Totally. I'm pretty sure it was me that was not accurate enough with it Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/75696-e6-setting-injection-timing-via-pulse-adapter/#findComment-579292 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fjh Posted 4 hours ago Share Posted 4 hours ago I think I read somewhere on some pumps you had to set with the throttle lever in the full position but not positive on this that’s a possibility of both of our issues as I described with the v8 fight there! Long as your engine sounds happy and you’re happy with it is all that matters! 🙄 Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/75696-e6-setting-injection-timing-via-pulse-adapter/#findComment-579301 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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