ThaddeusW

Sounds like you need more down pressure. What kind of pressure are you running in the axle. I know every application is different, But I am running between 90 and 100psi in mine. If your running 50 try 55 or 60

I second this, the pressure in the air bags is probably too low to keep the tires firmly on the ground. With too little force there isn't enough friction and the tires begin to lock up.

Check the pressure adjustment for the lift axle. Drive around and keep bumping up the pressure until the wheel stops skidding.

Since it is cut with diesel, gel may not be a big issue. I don't know. Brookhaven and Islip banned the sale of Bio along with E-85, I think it's a ground water thing. There was a few tractors at the show this weekend in the pull, running Bio Blend with no problems and PRATTS runs most of their machines on it. Makes me hungry to smell it.....mmmmmmmmm fries... Paul

Hmm interesting, In Farmingdale you can still get E-85.

I am sorry we missed each other at the show. It was a busy day and I only stayed a few hours. Next year I will be there with my B.

Wait till it gets cold outside. If you plan to run this in the winter, you will need to install fuel heaters cause it gells terrible when cool outside.

Peoria quit using it due to storage and winter operating costs.

Rob

Rob,

That I did not know. I doubt I will be going anywhere in the winter but starting it up once a week is something that I should do. Cant do that with jello in the tanks.

I know there are anti gel additives but the real question is do they actually work.

Has anyone here ran bio diesel in their older diesel engines? I see that some stations are offering B20 and a regional cooking oil recycler has a bio diesel club here in the city that offers B99 or pure bio diesel. The pure stuff is made to what they advertise as ASTM standards. I don't know if there is a big price difference, the pure stuff may be higher in price.

I would imagine any bio diesel sold as a motor fuel would have to be compatible with just about all diesel engines. Seeing how much my engine smokes, I thought it would be funny if the coal roll smelled like french fries (supposedly the smell produced by bio diesel).

That is awesome! Congrats on the award.

Now I know its pretty much normal behavior for an old diesel to smoke some but mine always smokes even when idle and temp comes up. My thinking is that its been sitting and needs to be ran a bit and that might gets things settled and maybe lessen some of the smoke.

My concern is the smoke police might pull me over because bumping the throttle gives you a nice grey black cloud of smoke. Anyone here have a run in with the smoke police while running an antique?

Do you plan to work the truck or is it a toy for show? It sounds like you want to work it, in that case if it does have an Allison (which it should) I would not worry about it much. Check the fluid for any burnt smell or particles like you would any auto trans. Allison automatics are in everything from buses to tanks and getting parts for them isn't a big deal but it will cost more than a manual to fix.

As long as you check your fluid levels and don't abusively shift the trans while moving, they are almost indestructible.

Someone is offering me a 1967 R403 Mack Dump Truck with automatic transmission for sale. Any one with experience with this truck? Any concerns?

R400's are not very common. Any idea what engine it has? They were offered with a small Scania Diesel, Chrysler V8 gasoline engine, Caterpillar 3208 (V8) and a few others. The transmission is probably an Allison automatic when are very tough.

Name: Mack B61T (1961)

Date Added: 13 July 2011 - 10:25 PM

Owner: ThaddeusW

Short Description: None Provided

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What sort of suspension does the tag axle have? The under dash valve is typical of an air tag set up. Flip the valve and screw the knob in or out to a predetermined pressure. Normally, just enough to equalize both axles when under a load. A neat thing about that set up was, back when the state highway scales could only weigh one axle pair at a time, they would set the scale platform for 32,000 plus allowance. If you were a little over gross you could crank the valve pressure up to shift weight to the steer, release the valve as the steer cleared the platform, and just keep rolling. Most of the tag axles that you saw were spring return. It doesn't take much to lift the axle at all. I don't see that what you have is poorly engineered at all. Figure out how it did work and fix it so that it will.

Here are two more pictures:

This is the part of the air bag support that is cracked clean off. Its also bent up pretty bad. Plus they welded it to the frame, something that should not be done, especially on the flange.

The suspension does have these chain mounts.

I figure I could remove the wheels if there is a problem. I am sure the ride quality will be affected if I inflate the air bags. If I don't inflate them the tag axle brakes will lock the wheels and it will drag along the road. Still on the fence here on what to do.

So the air lift tag axle on my B has a bad lifting bag. I checked out the lift mechanism and I think its partially homemade as this setup cant be what comes from a respected suspension manufacturer (Neway)

Here you see one end of the lifting lever. there is no pivot point or attachment. When the lift bag inflates, the arms simply rest on top of the cross member. This does not look right to me.

If you look the plate the air bag is mounted to is bent and cracked on one side where it meets the rail. It simply isn't strong enough to deal with the forces necessary for lifting the axle. You still cant see any pivot point. the only thing preventing the arms from falling off is the air bag. From each arm, a chain runs down to an attachment point on the suspension so I believe it is a lift axle suspension that some bought incomplete and fabricated this mess. That or the original mechanism went bad and this was its replacement.

This is a problem because I cant lift the axle unless I remove this contraption and chain the axle in the up position. That or I simply leave the axle in the lowered position but I would prefer to get the setup working. I also noticed that next to the drivers seat is a an air valve looking thing that has a pressure gauge on it which has the Neway logo on the gauge. Three holes are next to the valve where hoses probably ran through them to the valve thing. Next to that valve are two air toggle switches that don't appear to do anything. The lift axle is now controlled by this control box to the left in the picture:

Here is that valve thing:

Any ideas on how I can fix this? Can I find a left mechanism or should I look at buying a used lift axle?

So after fiddling with just about every lever, switch and knob in the cab I found my wiper knob. I gave it a twist and I see the wipers move outward but they do not return and I hear air hissing from behind the dash (when the engine is shut off). Is there a good procedure or trick to get the wiper motor running without removing it from behind the dash? I want to keep the air wipers even though they can be a huge pain.

Also is there a way to use more modern wiper blades on the arms?

GOOD. We have plenty of natural resources and we know how to turn gas into liquid fuels such as gasoline, kerosene and diesel. We can even derive the fuels from gasses obtained from coal which we have plenty of. The Germans invented the process during WW2, they have more coal then they know what to do with but no oil.

Very nice!!! What antique truck show will you take it to? I look forward to seeing it!!!

Good luck.

John

My goal is at least Gerharts, if I make better progress, the Watts show (If I can afford it lol). I sunk allot of cash into buying it so I have to be careful on how I spend in the coming weeks.

Ouch! IS that sheared right off? All you need is one little crack.

Now you damn skinflint! iffn' you'd just work a little harder,haul more dirt,(keep your engine running forwards)you'd have enough money to get A/C in Killerb! Me, i'm starting to think about pulling a reefer next summer,i'll turn the damn thing down to zero while unloading! way too fat,old, lazy to sweat like this! LOL!.........Mark

I dont think underwear was designed to take that kind of punishment.

Oil or grease packed hubs? Oil hubs have a rubber plug in the center of the cap window which is clear. No real difference to check the seals in any big truck than a small truck with grease packed hubs. Look on the back side through an inspection hole for grease running. If you pull the front hubs replace the seals.

Since there is not history so to speak, it wouldn't hurt a thing to either pack, or change the oil in the front hubs at a minimum. I would check/change all fluids myself.

Rob

Good question Rob. I think the lift axle may be grease although I am not sure. The lift axle has a plug in the center and what appears to be a drain plug off to the side. I have not yet looked over the front hubs, they are covered with the chrome Mack hub caps. Either Thursday or Friday I will pull them and see whats under there.

I assume the drive axle is is lubed with 80wt gear oil. Should I change it as well? The truck has sat for 3 to 5 years.

On the rear wheels, when its parked in one place for a while, watch for 90wt drips inside wheel. Mine had one seal leaking when I bought it, grease wasnt getting on rear drum, but dripping down and getting on inside dual. When I pulled it off to replace, it had a brand new seal in it, but too much roughness to seal, so used a different "sleeve" seal. It may be called a stemco seal. It has held ever since. randyp

I will check for that as well.

Since Dennis was an expert witness for many truck accident cases, the first thing he told me to check are the wheel seals. And I agree. Now i have done the hubs on a bigger truck before, but how do i check these. do i have to pull the wheels? What do i look for? I have a few ideas but i want the experts to tell me the right way.

Congratulations! Nice looking B. I know it's a lot of fun when you first get a new toy! Lots of fun down the road too. Trey

Thank you for the kind words everyone (and those who are yet to post)!

I thought the brake system was leaking something fierce. I now know how the "tractor protection valve" works. I thought it should be in the normal position, WRONG. Also the Neway lift bag is shot and the switch was in the up position which caused air to bleed right out of the system. After I sorted that out, the air system holds tight. After two hours of being shut off, it still had 60 psi in it.

I cant wait to get this puppy out on the road.

So I turned 31 on Sunday, and Today my birthday present arrived (well i paid for it ). 1961 B61 that is fully loaded. Its not all original as it was restored professionally by a Mack dealership about 10 years ago. It originally was a single axle that was stretched and had a lift axle installed. It starts and runs like a champ, sounds great because it has no mufflers (seriously, who would want to muzzle that sweet sound?) Its my 1st REAL truck. I plan to have allot of fun with this ol dog .

Run down of the truck:

- ENDT673 w/ Jake Brake (yep a Jake!)

- 9 speed OD duplex trans

- twin chrome stacks (5 or 6 inch)

- air lift tag on Neway lift suspension (with wedge brakes and 9.00R20's)

- good 11R22.5's on the steer and drive axle

- Spring brakes on the drive axle

- Brakes on the steer axle. (I believe original because i have the dry-slippery valve switch in the cab)

- Wet line (single line) for a dump trailer.

- Big Fruehauf winch (estimated 40,000 pounds) with capstans on each side, hydraulically driven from the wet system.

- Air ride drivers seat

- Roof mounted Kysor AIR CONDITIONING! ..... That doesn't work (that is going to be sorted out right quick)

- AM/FM/CB/ 8 Track radio that works! (who ever heard of a radio with a CB built in?)

- Little tool box on the passenger side behind the cab.

I have always wanted an F model, I am still addicted to F's but when a gem like this comes along, you just don't brush it off. I always check out OldMacks.com every week or so to see if anything new comes along. I saw it pop up a few months back and I loved it. I gave it some thought and figured I could afford it, this year my new years resolution was to buy a truck. During Macungie I saw the truck in his for sale book and here I am surronded by trucks, I couldnt resist, the planets aligned so to speak. I made a few calls, checked my bank account and waited for Dennis to come by his spot. During that time others were looking and that truck had them talking. I kept hearing "oh wow look at that truck" "thats a good truck to buy". F--- that I said, this truck is mine. Dennis pulls up and before he got off his cart i was right there next to him telling him i want to buy that B and we shook on the deal. I was on a high for the next 20 minutes, that what it must feel like to shoot heroin. No wonder its an addiction.

Today the truck came, the driver drove it off the trailer and into our yard. I moved around our vehicles and made room to pull it back so that it isn't blocking any of our vehicles. What a world of difference driving it, arm strong steering is a whole new game to me. All in all I had no problem jumping in, starting it and moving it around. The cab is quite small, smaller then our GMC. I bumped my head on the door jam the first two times getting into it .

UPDATE, Air brake system holds tight, I had to learn what air switches do what.

There are a few problems for me to sort through first. The main problem is the air system barely builds pressure, without revving it it doesn't go past 30 psi. I pulled it out of our yard and almost couldn't get it back in. Revving it up it builds up just over 60 psi, just enough to release the brakes. Major air leak toward the rear and I hear a hiss in the cab as well. Pressure drops like a stone when the engine is shut off (from 30PSI it bleeds to 0 in just over a minute). The air lift tag has a bad lifting bag with a big hole in it and who's hose is cut (don't see the other end yet). I also think the air bags on the lift axle are bad as well. It took about 5 min for me to rev the engine and release the brakes. One step on the pedal and the pressure take a dive and the knob pops out. I am going to hook an air line to the tanks and trace the leaks.

Expect lots of questions......

In the market for a set of drivers that are the odd size, 11 x 24 .

If I can't find the tires, how hard is it to change out the rim size on a open face or Dayton style drive wheel ??

The truck is a 1980 RD686sx and she runs good enough to get a new set of shoes.

Not in a big hurry and really don't want to spend a couple grand on tires.

Thanks in advance,

Norm

What size rears does it have? 55/58/65 thousand?

Those hubs are only going to mount a 24 inch tire. The best bet is to switch to 12.00R24 or you may be able to find Chinese 11-24 tires, they make some odd and old size tires.

Changing the hubs is more trouble than its worth unless you really want to mount other tires. you could go down to 22 inch hubs and mount 11r24.5 tires, those parts should not be hard to find. but the labor is going to cost you unless you want to do it yourself which may or may not be practical (if a wheel comes off and the lawyers ask you where you got the wheels fixed, your in for a world of butt hurt).

Oh, and can I please have my stapler?

I think you are talking about a Cummins rear drop manifold with the fin inside, The sound is different because the firing order of the cummins and the way the exhaust ports are. Basicly the front cylinder fires and then the back. The two exhaust pulses hit the rear of the manifold at the same time and then a slight pause. Kinda has a Jake brake sound to it to me.

Morgan

Yes, that is what I am thinking of. Was it a different engine model all together or just a different manifold? Were they turbo charged? It did sound like a jake brake, that interrupted exhaust note is quite unique.

I have has a question burning in my head for about a week. At Macungie there was an Autocar (or was it a Brockway) that had the Cummins with the west coast exhaust manifold. What model of engine was that and was it solely found in west coast trucks? Did any ever find their way into Macks? It had one hell of a unique sound, I wish I made a recording.

That trailer looks good hooked to the F. I assume it was too far gone to restore. Shame really, would have made a nice pair.

Hey guys,

ive got a late modle metro liner that seems to have abit of an air issue. when the park brake is released it drops the service brake air pressure. im thinking the only spot the two air systems cross over is in the priority valve in the bottom of the air drier? any ideas?

The spring brakes are fed by both the primary and secondary air systems via a two way check valve. When you push the yellow knob in and your air pressure begins to drop, you have a leak somewhere in the system. The air dryer feeds both the primary air system which operates the brakes on the rear driving axles and the secondary air system feeds the steering axle(s). Both systems are isolated by check valves. Both systems also feed the spring brakes on the truck/tractor and the trailer emergency/supply (red) line.

There could be a leak in one of your brake chambers, air lines to the brake chambers or your spring brake relay valve. Let the truck build air pressure, shut the engine off, block your wheels and release the brakes. Get under the rear of the truck and listen for leaks. Also a spray bottle with soapy water sprayed on the brake lines/components will reveal leaks as well, though, I suspect if you see a rapid and drastic drop in pressure you have a large leak and should be able to hear it.

See this diagram for a better idea of how the brakes work. Follow the yellow lines, they are the spring brake lines. Its not guaranteed your truck is plumbed the same, things may be slightly different in Australia/NZ and between trucks in general (the diagram is also a bit dated). But that diagram is pretty much the foundation of any air brake system in North American designs.