herefixyfixy Posted May 2, 2023 Share Posted May 2, 2023 Howdy All, New to the sight and need some info. Received a cam and lifter kit that came from PAI. Should have been ceramic lifters, but got steel. Literally argued for an hour to get them to send the right ones. Finally they told me that there are no ceramics anywhere in stock. I read in one of the posts that you could use the steel in place of the ceramics, but you had to plug the oil on the rocker with a rivet. Anyone have any more info on this? The kit came with small drive in rivets, so assuming that is what they are for. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thank You! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fjh Posted May 3, 2023 Share Posted May 3, 2023 Sorry no one has nibbled on this ! I have never run into this situation so do want to steer you wrong! Someone may have an answer at so point keep checking back! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joey Mack Posted May 3, 2023 Share Posted May 3, 2023 I didn't bite because the only time I put rivets in a rocker arm was on an early E-Tech for the top oil feed update.. I'm curious, and expect to learn something. Sure would like pics of the parts list and the rocker shaft assembly... And pics of the rivets.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vmac3 Posted May 3, 2023 Share Posted May 3, 2023 Here is a service bulletin that explains the changes. sb213032.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joey Mack Posted May 3, 2023 Share Posted May 3, 2023 After reading this bulletin, I dislike ceramic lifters even more.. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fjh Posted May 3, 2023 Share Posted May 3, 2023 1 hour ago, Joey Mack said: After reading this bulletin, I dislike ceramic lifters even more.. Kinda think you could use the spring loaded tubes on the steel rollers as is! just not the other way around just my thought on it! I think the spring tubes were implemented to eliminate any cracking the ceramic rollers that may occur during high speed operation and engine braking! In the early days they attributed most flat lifter failures to the engine brake I believe! When the steel rollers failed it was a hard surfacing issue on the cam or roller! 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vmac3 Posted May 3, 2023 Share Posted May 3, 2023 There were some granite that I switched over from ceramic to steel rollers. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fjh Posted May 3, 2023 Share Posted May 3, 2023 3 minutes ago, Vmac3 said: There were some granite that I switched over from ceramic to steel rollers. V#3 Did you change to solid tubes or stick with the spring load tubes ? think this would help this guy with his decision ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vmac3 Posted May 3, 2023 Share Posted May 3, 2023 I used spring loaded push rods on the exhaust and 417s on the intakes. The hardware in the valve train was updated, and the rockers were plugged off with rivets. This really helped with longevity. It's important to ensure that the spring loaded push rod is adjusted properly. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vmac3 Posted May 3, 2023 Share Posted May 3, 2023 (edited) Those ceramic lifters were a problem when they switched over. They were failing as much as the steel rollers. Not sure what they changed in the 04-07 engines. Maybe a different finish on the cam, or the introduction of the power leash. With my experience we seen a dramtic decrease of cam failures in those model years. Not saying they never happened, just sayin way fewer failures. The egr stuff kept us busy instead. Edited May 3, 2023 by Vmac3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fjh Posted May 3, 2023 Share Posted May 3, 2023 4 minutes ago, Vmac3 said: Those ceramic lifters were a problem when they switched over. They were failing as much as the steel rollers. Not sure what they changed in the 04-07 engines. Maybe a different finish on the cam, or the introduction of the power leash. With my experience we seen a dramtic decrease of cam failures in those model years. Not saying they never happened, just sayin way fewer failures. The egr stuff kept us busy instead. Power leash was a bit of a different animal Sure improved the braking! How ever need to help this guys situation I think you answered his question! all good ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joey Mack Posted May 3, 2023 Share Posted May 3, 2023 Hopefully he uses the steel lifters... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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