Doug Maney

As it looks now, I will be at WHQ for the "Road Trip". I will certainly have a camera with me and will get photos to share. Doug

It would be great to have it as a summer home/historical spot. I agree it would be great if a Mack enthusiast would buy the place. Time will tell! I forwarded the photos to the Mack Museum for the files. Doug

That is the Chalmers Collection, there are a few more there as well!

I stopped by the homestead in Mount Cobb, PA. This is the farm where the brothers were born & raised. I have admired it for years and finally took the time to stop and take some pictures. I have included one here and added several to my gallery. I hope you enjoy! Doug

The early C model bus used a bright slightly diamond shaped emblem with a script in black in the center.

How about the early B hood side emblem, it was the shape of a trapazoid to mimic the AC style hood from the front. It was a brass surround with black inlay with gold script.

Honorable mention includes the early L and F hood side emblem. The script cut from a steel sheet and chromed. These were replaced by the formed script used through the mid '60's.

Any more?

I can post photos of most of these if there is an interest.

Doug

I was waiting for someone to mention the off road front emblem. They were only used on the prototype trucks used in the photos. I looked into them and couldn't verify any production trucks with them factory mounted.

off-highway used the chrome trapazoid with black R-model style Mack script on the top of the grille shell.

As long as we are talking off-highway:

off-highway trucks used a large version of the R-model type script cut from flat aluminum on the sides of the hood.

These were only used on off-highway trucks.

Of course being a G model owner and enthusiast, I have heard so many variations of the Mack vs. KW story that I could't remember them all. I have done extensive research on the G, reviewed build records, put together somewhat of a timeline of production and discussed with former Mack employees about the Great Western G. Unless someone out there can offer some proof, there was never a lawsuit regarding the G including some KW type features. My research does support the fact that KW did have a problem with the Mack design and possibly threated a suit if the G continued. No money changed hands, no judgements were issued it seems to have just ended with the introduction of the New F model in 1962.

Unconfirmed rumors that Mack hired a designer from KW leads to the similarities between the 2 cabovers. The concerns that KW were upset by were the access door into the left front of the cab and the left and right door design.

The access panel offered service to the backside of the dash and pedals where before you had to stand on your head on the floor of the truck to work in that area. KW offered a similar panel at the same time as Mack.

To the naked eye a G passenger compartment door and a KW door look identical, there are similarities in their construction but the overall size is different. A KW door will fit on a G but leaves an air gap around the top of the door frame that you could pass a pillow through. With this said, KW vent wing and side window seals will not work on a G door.

There have been many antique truckers that have claimed a lawsuit over this deal, I have never seen any proof. At this point I have to trust my research and sources. I always try to explain my position on the subject and usually don't get very far. A lot of antique truckers have an opinion on the Mack vs. KW story, you would think the G would have sold better since everyone seems to have had such first hand knowledge!

Sounds to me like a new topic!!

No they didn't recycle any G model stuff, they talked about it! I spoke with an engineer that worked for Mack at the time, they considered reusing some of the items from the G but it didn't prove to be worthwhile.

Good question, good eye!

Good thinking on the H-60 & 61, and of course on the Juniors. I would like to have a few of each of them sitting around!

Lets give some others the opportunity to chime in, I'll see how things are going and fill in the blanks later in the week.

I hope others like this type of discussion on the board, there have been several good ones on the Antique Truck Club of America discussion board lately as well. Check it out when you get the chance!

I consider this the true reason for this type of board. Where else can you go to get the answers to some of the or antique truck related questions that have been bouncing around for years.

The Cruiseliner emblem was not mounted on a firetruck by .

The C model fire apparatus, formerly Beck Fre Apparatus used a completely different emblem. It included a side profile of a chrome rounded style bulldog with Mack script in gold. This emblem was also used on some of the Mack bus line. The gold Mack script was above the bulldog profile. This emblem is constructed of plastic and includes an aluminum trim ring. The Cruiseliner emblem is smaller and consists of red glass laid over the chrome base.

Alot of people think these are the same emblem, but they are considerably different when placed side by side.

Doug

Typically has used standard emblems to identify their products. Over the years there have been occasions when they have strayed from the norm. I have several examples, can any others be identified?

D-models, the second styling, the version with the rounded front grille, rear cab corner windows, and the dog emblems below the vent wing windows on the doors.

The side profile rounded style Bulldogs in the emblems are approximately 1/2 the size of the standard dog profile.

N-models, the budd cab Mack that everyone thinks is a Ford.

The Mack script on the doors below the windshield posts is approximately 1/2 the size of the standard Mack script.

Cruiseliner, the mid '70s attempt at an aluminum cabover.

The long ear modern era Bulldog side profile finished in silver or gold, surrounded by a red glass sunburst.

These emblems were not used on any other product offered by .

There are several other examples that I will hold off on for now. Lets hear what you have to say!

Doug

As far as older western market aimed trucks, yes there was the Great Western Series! The Great Western models came about with the pending introduction of the G model. The G was the aluminum cabover aimed directly at capturing a spot in fleets dominated by off brand trucks. The goal was to offer a chassis with off brand engines and components similar to what the generic truck assemblers were offering. The Great Western models included B's and G's. As far as I know the s/n tag does not specify "Great Western", at least none of mine do. They used the regular tag for all of my G's.

Earlier models directed at the western market were of course the LT and the W-71. I don't think they had any sort of descriptive title associated with their attempt at trying to cut into left coast trucking.

The Cruiseliner was introduced in November 1974.I've never seen one titled as a '74 but have known of many '75's.

Right on! The Cruiseliner was introduced as a new model in 1975. I wasn't sure exactly what month the Cruiseliner was actually opened up to the public. I was confident that with all new vehicles the production starts approximately a year before the first ones are sold. Prototypes are run down the line to identify problems with the builds and hopefully eliminate them before the demand hits. I guess the Cruiseliner demand never really hit!

This gives me another idea for a post topic! Doug

This question has been raised several times, lets get to the bottom of it!

The Hayward, California plant was opened in January 1966.

They started with the FL and in 1967 constructed the RL model. These models featured aluminum components mounted on aluminum frame rails. FS and RS models were introduced in 1967, these featured steel frame rails with similar components to the L versions. In 1974 The Hayward plant added the W "Cruiseliner" model to its lineup. These were built both in Hayward and ultimately in the Macungie Assembly Facility. In 1978 when the RW "Superliner" was introduced, they were built both in Hayward and Macungie. The serial number plate on the door will specify Mack Western, Hayward, CA. The Western plant closed in 1980 pulling the assembly back to Pennsylvania.

Did assemble any other models in Hayward?

Does anyone have any interesting tales pertaining to the Hayward plant or their Western products?

Yes, the hood scoops were used on the 300+, it was the air intake for the tip turbine. An R-700 was not only a Hayward built truck, they were built in Pennsylvania as well. The western built trucks were labelled as such and most if not all were RL or RS models with aluminum components. Knowing how was at the time I would think that they may have built some standard spec trucks in the western plant. I am going to start a new thread on this subject.

As it has been stated, I verified today that the hood scoop was used on the R until '75-76 model year. The changeover may have allowed you to end up with either a hood scoop or two pipe air cleaner. The reason for going away from the scoop was to eliminate debris from getting sucked into the air cooler. Heavier models such as DM, DMM and RM used the scoop into the '80's. I didn't verify the last year I saw them on the Mack calendars but I probably will just for giggles. Doug

Hey!

Please contact me when you get back around PA. I have a backhaul you may beinterested in the next time you go west! Doug

Planet toys has a new Rawhide and Vision replica on the market. Check out eBay:

Item number: 7004662866

Item number: 7004660336

Item number: 7004658885

Stuper bowl? My thought is that the real winners will be the team owners, players, breweries, bar owners, pizza joints, the city wherever it is being held, the business owners capitalizing on the fans, airline companies, ticket scalpers, petroleum companies (like Exxon/Mobil), television companies, and last but not least, the snack food companies.

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

I hope you fans enjoy the thing! I plan on watching Convoy, Moonfire and after the daughter goes to bed, Freeway Maniac. Macks,Macks and more Macks! Go Bulldogs! (The truck kind.)

I believe the hood scoop lasted until frontal air cooling was introduced in 1981. I'll do a little research and verify the years they offered the hood scoop. I have been picking them up when I can, I always liked the look of them. They were used on all of the conventional models including the steel front butterfly hoods.

RS, RL and Valueliners used a hood that carried the bodyline back the top of the hood toward the cab. I liked this arrangement, it allowed for some creative striping.

Doug

The Road Hammers are a band out of Canada. They were the entertainment at the Western-Star bash at the Mid-America trucking show. We were impressed and I am by no means a country music fan! They cover some great trucker tunes and have some good originals.

The Diamond Reo name was sold at the sale, Furnley Equipment in Duncannon owns it now. Diamond Reo built their last truck in 1997(I believe) at the old factory along route 322 between Harrisburg and Hershey. The Giant nameplate was used when there were controversies regarding the Diamond Reo name. This was in the mid to late '80's and early '90's. In 1988 I toured their new factory off of Paxton street in Harrisburg. I think Pennsyvania helped get them going in the new facility at the time. That didn't last long.

Nice display. Great theme music, we Love TSO! We sometimes think we're nuts for our hobby! I can't even fathom the amount of time spent on putting this together, of course he'd look at one of our trucks and think the same! Doug

The All Meet will be a 2 day show this year!

DAYS 2005

at: Gerhart Equipment Co.

910 Brunnerville Rd.

Lititz, P A 17543

FRIDAY, SEPTEMBER 30

SATURDAY, OCTOBER 1

TRUCKS, BUSES and FIRE APPARATUS

All TRUCKS FROM 1900 to 2006 ARE WELCOME TO ATTEND!

hosted by

Gerhart Equipment Co.

PO Box 4O5

Lititz, PA 17543

(717) 626-8544

OPEN TO THE PUBLIC

NO ENTRY FEE

FOOD AVAILABLE