Bullheaded

We ordered 2 Titans several months ago but nobody at Mack could tell what they would cost. Well finally on Monday we got pricing info. I was shocked at how cheap our dealer price was. I'm not in sales so I dont know how much we will mark them up but I was figuring our cost would be around $150,000. Our actual cost was way cheaper than that. There was also a small option check list too, mostly trans and rear axle options.

Our local dealer has two in, had them about a month now. They have one out as a demo. They are both 605 h.p. float tractors. Salesman said they need to talk to Mack reps about price as they are pretty high here. These tractors are plain, nothing but a fifth wheel on the frame and they are $160,000.00! They are Rawhides, but no headache racks or lift axles, just wet lines.

Well I tried to upload pics of my Challenger brochure (they show the big glorious E9 V8 under the hood) but this awful, useless dial up won't let me. After 45 minutes it still said "uploading file." Funny I can email pics, but can't seem to be able to upload them to this site. I'll try a smaller pic, hope this works.

Ok, I checked it out by using the parking brake and punching the throttle method and it seems to work. With parking brake on, it smokes a good dark cloud on full throttle. With brake released, less than half as much smoke. How doggy are these motors supposed to be. The truck that it is in is a "roll off box" truck. Truck's empty weight is a tad over 30k. Even empty, when starting to go up hills on the interstate here in south central iowa, it slows down, it seems to take forever to get to 55 mph. Today with 20k in the box, there were a few hills that had me down to 40 mph in 4th gear and still slowly slowing down and I have Yet to see it smoke from the stack. We're thinking maybe somebody before us turned it Down? we just put all new filters on it and that didn't help at all. I dont know how loud the turbo is supposed to be on these but i know that with the straight through stack it's loud enough already. We're thinking about having a local truck shop look at it and see if he thinks it can easily and safely be turned up some or if something is wrong with it. Any other ideas guys? I really appreciate the quick replies already. I'm loving this site more and more!

Before you disconnect make sure the puff limiter hasn't just been re-shimmed. It's been a few years since I worked on one of these so I can't remember if turning it in or out makes the throttle response. One of the experts here can tell you. I had to take one of the ones I drove for the mandatory emmisions test we have here and the dealer shimmed it to make it pass. When I went to leave it had very slow response and would barely accelerate itself up to speed. I had to re-shim it when I got home.

Also, instead of just plugging the air lines, I ran mine through an air switch. (same one as for a power divider or the one used for the deep reduction on the 12 speed.) That way you could make it smokeless if the dot is around, and get the power when you need it.

Your welcome and yes the favorite engine was 12 71, I had the opertunity to do a V8 transplant on one of these made it a ture mack e9 and a 12 sp all but maybe 2 were born with 12s the others had KT cummins special order ,husby forest still runs some now with I beleive ser 60 repowers.

Our shop handled or pdied most of these units there where a large amount of updates to do before they were put to work We modified fuel tanks, planitarys had a few glitches and the mack wheel lock was disposed of for a more tire man friendly setup.there where a bunch more tidleeys done to many to list!

All In All second only to the challenger It was the best of the fat trucks!

The guy that built th challenger was rumored to have sold the company and plans to the ausies for an ore hauler!They even hired his engineer. Rumors rumors!

Thanks again fjh! Must have been cool working on those. The Challenger name is going again. You are correct, the Australians bought it and they have (had?) a web site. They still look the same but the last time I saw the web site it didn't list any specs or what they are using for power now. I'll have to search for the site again this weekend.

That guy from BC that started Challenger was really nice. I first seen them in an issue of Highway Star Magazine and was blown away, so I contacted them. I told them I was in no way able to buy a rig like that, but was impressed and would like to learn more. The next thing I know, I receive a package in the mail with a brochure and a bunch of pics he took of some of the trucks he built and that were in service. If I get a chance this weekend I'll post some. There were the loggers and a really nice ore hauler. It's too bad to see him have to sell, but like you said the Canadian market really dried up. I hope he made out good on the sale because he was first class in my books.

Ya there was a couple Superliners with V8 Detroits in my erea when I was a kid. They were the original Superliners with the round headlights and they had the big walk in bunks on them. They were really good looking trucks. The loggers used to run them until they switched to E9's. I know where one is sitting right now in a scap yard but it is stripped and pretty rough. The old 2 strokes used to be real popular in this area.

I did some more digging. Mack's web site says the CL350ST was designed in Canada and built at the Oakville, Ontario Canada plant. They show production from 1976 to 1979 with 27 made in those years. I have a Canadian Bulldog Magazine (vol.82 #1) I believe from 1980 that has a pic of a brand new CL350ST painted yellow with a green stripe. The quote says "Heinz and Mike Portmann of Campbell River have taken delivery of the first or two CL350ST units for logging operation in Loughborough Inlet." Pretty impressive looking unit. I imagine they had Detroit power like most other fat trucks of the time did?

I have a Mack product line brochure from 1978 that shows the M Series and Mack-Pack. There is only one pic (single axle dump truck) and details are limited other than saying they available with 800 h.p. 2 or 4 cycle engines and Mack Planidrive axles. Also interesting to note Mack was the only haul truck manufacturer in that class with all wheel disc brakes. Macks website has production of M series-1960 to 1979, M100-1967 to 68 at 3 units, MP404X-1976 to 1978 at 20 units. That's all the info I can find on the Big Macks. Other than I have that hardcover book "Mack Driven for a Century" and it has some pics. They show a restored M100 tandem dump truck, brown in colour. Very nice. I wonder how many are still around in the hands of collectors?

If anyone has any other info or pics please post. Thanks for the other info fjh.

I remember when I was young, I have an uncle that lived by the Oakville plant and he told me he saw a giant dump truck there one day. I do remember driving by it when it just before it went out of operation, but all I remember is R models as far as the eye could see. Does anyone have any pics from the Oakville plant?

A couple other interesting facts I came up with are the DMM (EX) twin steer front drive trucks were designed in Canada in 1972 and also the RD800 in 1980.

I used to love those. I have some Bulldog magazines from the early 80's that have pics of one of those CL 350 ST's painted yellow. Was that something that came out of the Hayes relationship? Or did Mack make them themselves?

Same with the M Series mining trucks and the articulated Mack-Pack. You never really heard or seen much of them. Did someone make those for Mack? I'd like to see a pic of that Mack-Pack all wheel drive articulated bottom dump.

Have you guys ever heard of Challenger Trucks from British Columbia, Canada. They used to rebuild Hayes, Pacific, Mack, KW, etc. I-beam tractors for the logging and mining industry, then designed their own truck with a lot of new updates over those previous designs. I have a brochure and pics from them and the Mack E-9 was their standard spec engine. They offered all the big Cat, Cummins and V12 Detroits but praised the Mack E9 as having the best power to weight to fuel economy ratio of all the engines. They also praised the reliability of them.

Sweet looking B Model mixer there Other Dog!

Wow this is a tough one! I love all Mack's but I have to go with the 70's and 80's. Maybe it's because that is what I grew up around and drove. But you have to look at the broad product range you had to choose from. So many awesome models in this era. Everything from F, Cruiseliner, Ultraliner, MR cabovers to the R Model (with it's RD and RM offshoots), Superliners, DM's, and the M series Mack-Pack off road haul truck lineup and CL350ST heavy I-beam trucks! Then you have the motors. The unmatched E-6 and E-9's.

Like rockinrandolph said, I also had E-6 350's that would outpull C15 475 Cat's and get way better fuel mileage. Too bad Mack didn't sell glider kits like Western Star is doing now. Imagine a new Titan with an E-9 500!!

Hello everyone. I posted a bunch of pics in my gallery of the Truck World show I just attended in Toronto, Ontario. Keep checking in later in the week and I'll try to get more pics up. I can only get this crappy dial up internet in my area and it took me 6 hours to get 20 pics posted. So I'll try to do a little at a time when I can.

They had that red Titan there along with the Rawhide sleeper cab that is in all the brochures and adds. They also had a nice yellow Pinnacle with all the new technology such as that no idle system, and a Simard twin steer Granite dump truck. I'll try to get pics up of the MP8 and MP10 cut-away motors they had on display. I have to say, that new Rawhide interior package is awesome. I love the oxblood red and white two-tone. I think it's the nicest interior Mack has offered so far. Especially the paw print floor with the chrome diamond plate floor mats. Nice little touches. The guys from Simard said they can't wait to offer the Titan with their twin steer front and tri-drive on the rear. That's going to be one impressive looking monster. That twin-steer Granite dump had lots of nice features too, like the heated windshield.

The Mack and International booths pretty much stole the show.

Another truck of interest was a 1971 International Super Transtar. One of only 67? made. It was restored 100% original and had a big red V12 Detroit under the cab. Brought back some old memories when I heard that 2-stroke Detroit running.

The pic of the Harley is a bike Mack gave away. It was all decked out in Mack emblems.

The Titan was pretty nice. I can't wait to see the future versions with sleepers and a heavy dump application. I liked the new air cleaner set up under the cab, and there was lots of room under the hood. I'm looking forward to the one my local dealer is bringing in to demo. They are getting one with a wetline system, so I'll have to try it out.

Whoops, not sure how I posted two, but how do I remove one? Sorry.

More fuel for the fire I just got back from the big truck show in Toronto. I was talking to reps from Western Star and Detroit Diesel and they said Freightliner is planning to also drop Cat, and go back to Cummins as their only other supplier. And the Cat reps said they are definetly not going out of the engine business. They showed their new transmissions and said they are taking a wait and see approach before they annonce their 2010 emmissions solution. They also said it is their engine business that makes it financially possible to develop all the new technologies for their equipment line engines.

Wow. You never know who owns who anymore

More fuel for the fire I just got back from the big truck show in Toronto. I was talking to reps from Western Star and Detroit Diesel and they said Freightliner is planning to also drop Cat, and go back to Cummins as their only other supplier. And the Cat reps said they are definetly not going out of the engine business. They showed their new transmissions and said they are taking a wait and see approach before they annonce their 2010 emmissions solution. They also said it is their engine business that makes it financially possible to develop all the new technologies for their equipment line engines.

Wow. You never know who owns who anymore

Hello everyone. Here's a couple answers. My truck tares in at 12,700kg (27,998 pounds) with half a tank of fuel (300 litres). It was a little lighter new, but I put a pintle plate and hitch on and have some thick conveyor belting on the inside of the tailgate. That Beau-Roc Diamond Line box is 900 pounds lighter than a post style box, but I will never buy another Beau-Roc. Lots of problems like all the welds breaking (after 3 months of hauling asphalt, legal loads) and they wouldn't stand behind their warranty. Said it was driver abuse I am legal to gross 35,700kg (78,704 pounds), so I usually carry 22 to 23 metric tonnes. Our weight laws in Ontario require you to have 101" from the steer to the lift. And wide axle spacings on the drives. I can gain a ton by going to a 72" axle spread, but don't feel it justifies the added tire scrub and wear and tear to the truck. You definately have to lift the axle for tight corners (they want us to run 90 psi. in them, I don't). And I leave it up off road most of the time. HK Trucking is right, most steerables reqire super singles which would knock one tonne off my legal payload. Plus the added cost to buy, so most of us just lift. I never have any odd tire wear, so they aren't too bad. I did price a Granite with that Simard air ride twin steer front end and they were about $20,000 compared to about $7000.00 for a lift. They are a nice set up though, especially the air ride ones, because you can dump the pressure in the second axle to get better traction when stuck. If guys would get the rates up we could afford to buy that nice fancy stuff. The twin steers are real popular around the Ottawa, Quebec area. I'd like my next truck to be a Titan with that setup. I have some pics I'll try to get up in the gallery soon of a Granite at the Toronto show with the twin steer.

How do you like the Brandon box Joe D. They sell them here now, but I haven't looked at one yet.

Thanks for the specs Skullsquadron X. I knew Mack used to be a big producer of buses, but I didn't know much about them. I always focused my attention on trucks. Plus I've never saw a Mack bus in this area ever. Interesting.

What part of Ontario are you from? One of my good friends lives in Elliot Lake.

Hello everyone. I'm just north of Sault Ste. Marie, Other Dog. About 3.5 hours from Elliot Lake. They have real nice ATV trails around Elliot Lake

This might be slightly off topic, but I've been hearing rumors that International will be offering Cat engines in their Medium-Duty trucks and Buses (IC Corp) in the near future. It will be interesting to see what happens.

Here's another twist on that. I've read on other forums of a rumour that Cat has bought International. I thought that was crap because International has just released their own big bore engine (partnership with MAN) and all the dealers around here seem to be pushing Cummins. Cummins power was also used while developing the new Prostar. Well here's where it gets interesting. I'm in a local Cat dealer getting my ecm reflashed the other day and the mechanic, seeing how I'm into my "binder" says that a Cat rep was in the other day for a shop visit and he said Cat has just partnered with Navistar and they are working on a Cat truck. He would give no other details. But he did say Cat is losing sales due to Paccar coming out with their own engines and losing other oem's such as Mack. And that the new emmisions Cat's are too wide to fit most chassis, so they want to partner with someone that will design a truck that fits with Cat's plan. Seems hard to believe to me, but I've seen stranger things happen. Never would have thought International would buy GM's medium truck line and they did, so who knows. That's probably why you heard Cat motors will be going in the mediums. They said they are going to keep the GM line separate from the Int's and GM has always offered the small Cat's.

Nice looking truck. Do you go uut of town that you need the camper.

Yes, I work out of town all the time. Local guys at home here cut the rates so bad you can't afford to work here. I bought the trailer because I was sick of motel rooms. It more than pays for itself. Plus the nice thing is when the kids are out of school for summer break, them and the wife come stay with me, so we get to all be together. Makes it easier to be away all the time. I try not to tow it with the big truck too much, but it usually goes to a location and stays all summer. I'm looking into getting one of those air ride receiver hitches.

Welcome to Big Mack Trucks Shawn.

Hey, thanks. I see you have a Mack bus. What's the details on it. What did they have for power?

Anyone have any interior pics of the Rawhides yet?

Anyone think Mack will ever offer their own version of the volvo I-Shift auto trans with the MP10. Also wonder if the upcoming Maxidyne version of the MP10 605 will have even more h.p. or torque? That's a combo i'd like in the Titan.

Hey Bullhead,

I saw your truck on the International owners gallery. Very nice ride.

Thank You. just wish it got the fuel mileage of the old 350 R model.

Just something I was looking at a couple weeks ago at a dealer in Sudbury, Ontario.

Crap! Says my file is too big to upload. I don't know if or how to resize?

Anyway, I took some pics of a bunch of new Granites they brought in with the cab, chassis and fuel tanks all painted bright red. I thought they looked real sharp.

Thanks for the pics Barry Superdog mentioned the name....I know my local dealers kept telling the Mack reps to call it a Superliner when word first come out about it, but it didn't happen. You'll never equal the legend, but the name might of helped sales of the new one? I agree with Aus Chris, they should have kept the Aussie air intake stacks. How hard to service the filters? I heard they are under the cab? Still better than the underhood filters. Anyone have any experience with the 600 Volvo's? I heard they perform well, but they'll still never equal an E9.

I do like the new interiors. I've been looking at some Granites. I love the paw print floor mats.

I was ready to sell the "binder" when I saw the Titan, but I keep hearing horror stories of the new pdf equipped motors? There's just too much to go wrong with these new trucks.

I can't wait until April 17th. I'll be at Truck World in Toronto, Ontario drooling all over that Titan. Between it and the new International Lonestar, I don't think I'll even notice what else is at the show.

Nice looking truck,great story. Sounds like some great times.

Thanks Thermodynediesel. I put lots of work into that truck. The years of salt take their toll. I never got around to repainting the dump box when the pics were taken.

I've been down in your state the last week. I've been hauling steel coils to Dodge Centre, Minnesota. Real beautiful scenery down there