Jamaican Bulldog

Thanks for that info. I was curious if it was designed in house or joint venture with Isuzu or VM Motori

Interesting article especially this bit. "There are those who say Mack is today nothing like its forebears, and they’re right. However, Mack today also produces and sells more trucks than any time in its ‘glorious past’."

As a Ford salesman who handles commercial vehicle sales too there are areas where I agree and disagree with you. We gladly welcome the Ranger back. Where I disagree: Todd Eckert lobbied for years to bring back the Ranger. I think he understands the U.S market a lot more than his boss Mr Hassert. Like you, I also like manual shift but in the last years of the previous Ranger and previous generation F series the take rate for manuals were very low. The reality is that many people don't know or care to drive sticks anymore. The automatics have become more efficient and have higher towing capability than the sticks. An automatic is also easier to integrate with the rest of the components of the car such as terrain management and features that will soon be mandated on every car such as stop/start systems or auto braking and accident avoidance systems. Manual shift are not in high demand in the U.S like the rest of global markets. A similar thing with the diesel. Even in the heavier super duty Ford F series we have a higher take rate for gas engines than diesels. Apart from diesel fuel being more expensive than gas in many markets, many customers do not justify the extra upfront costs for the diesel engine over the probable fuel savings with a diesel. Some are still turned off from high maintenance costs associated with diesels after the 7.3. Fuel prices are often much higher in most countries that prefer diesels. A viable diesel engine in the U.S Ranger would have to be one that is not too much of an expensive upgrade and significant fuel savings without much sacrifice of performance. I don't think the Ranger was ruined for the U.S market. In many markets where the Ranger is sold the F-150 is not, unless individually imported. So the Ranger comes in more varieties in those markets and grew in size over the years. The U.S market has a larger preference for full size pick ups while other markets don't. Where I agree with you: While Ford may be afraid to cannibalize sales and thus profits from the larger F-150, they grossly underestimated the demand for small pick up trucks and allowed the older Ranger to slowly die due with no updates in years. As they have found out after missing out for years, not everyone wants a bigger truck even if the costs are close. The older ones are still in high demand and its surprising how much an older one even with high mileage can sell for. Believe it or not most customers we have wanted back that older Ranger size not the size of the new one. There is still a market in the U.S for a regular cab basic small pick-up even with a normally aspirated gas engine such as Ford's reliable 2.5 liter. But there is no regular cab variant or that engine to be offered here. I also hope the new Ranger will be able to plow.

I guessing the numbers indicate the speeds and 'LR' indicate low range but what did M, MLR, and ME in the series number indicate?

Was the drop in demand for Mack Transmission due to cost or was quality a factor? Someone told me years ago that a mack transmission was $2000 more than a Eaton.

It might be hard to find a decent one for that price range between 1985 and 90, but if you consider one a few years older you might find one like this. https://hartford.craigslist.org/cto/d/1981-mack-model/6428560741.html

Just browsing the Mack website and I was surprised and glad to see under the description for the Maxitorque transmission that it comes in 19 models and ranges from 6 speeds up to 18! I did not realize that they were so many types of the Mack transmission available especially since Eaton and automatics seem to be more common. What is the take rate for this transmission? Despite the popularity of the Eaton and automatics are there still niches that give the Mack transmission an advantage over the others? I also thought that the mack transmission was only available in maybe 3 type of speed versions (13, 15,18). Who or what type of application still gets a 6 speed? Does it still give the advantage or the original integrated powertrain high torque rise concept? Years ago I saw a DM with a 7 spd but thought anything less than that was discontinued.

Nice superliner dump truck for sale in NJ https://newjersey.craigslist.org/cto/d/88-mack-superliner-dump-truck/6445003302.html

Me neither, but I guess we can watch it with this youtube link

Like many on here I enjoy movies that feature trucks such as Convoy, Black Dog etc. However my favorite has always been Maximum Overdrive where a machines came alive and some old trucks kept people hostage at a gas station. Where there any other truck movies that featured so many old Macks? Of all the remakes of movies nowadays and since technology is such a big part of our lives I always figured a remake a movie about our modern personal machines taking over would be cool.. including trucks.

Good point. Even today the bigger car companies that have their own finance bank can have an advantages over smaller ones because even if the cars are more expensive they can offer lower rates and flexibility in terms to offset it. For example companies like Mazda and Subaru normally have their finances and lease supported by Chase but larger companies like Ford have their own finance like Ford Motor Credit

I remember in the late 80s people would say that Macks were more expensive than the average competitor but I also noticed that Mack also won a lot of municipal bids. Could it be that Mack took such low bids on fleets that it affected them financially? I know some car companies like the I work for have reduced their eagerness to seek large fleet sales because of the low mark ups. There was a time they would want them to pump up sales numbers that looked good in magazines.

Yes so true. Good looking those Australian Internationals

Thats why I said it has to be 51% Chinese gov OWNED joint venture, at least.

Yep. And they were common in the British Commonwealth such as those in the Caribbean.

I could see where you are right. I was perplexed when I saw it referenced as private. Nothing that large is normally private in China. Maybe he is a Princeling in the Communist party. Even large foreign companies that build things there have be a 51% Chinese gov owned joint venture.

According to this article in Automotive News, Geely owned by Chinese billionaire Lu Shufu is the largest privately owned auto company in China. I am not sure in what context of 'private' that is in China. http://www.autonews.com/article/20171228/OEM02/171229878/ ".....If the successful revival of Volvo cars under Li is any precedent to go by, the transaction may be beneficial to Volvo trucks as well. Li started out making refrigerator parts and later turned a bankrupt state-owned manufacturer into China’s biggest privately owned carmaker. He cemented his reputation as a savvy dealmaker after reviving Volvo Car in the face of widespread industry skepticism following the purchase from Ford in 2010. He gave Volvo Car’s engineering team the resources to invest in new models. At the same time, he lowered the Swedish manufacturer’s high costs by jointly developing vehicle underpinnings with Geely, while building a plant in lower-cost China for exports to markets including the U.S."

Geelyis also the largest privately owned auto co in China.

Many of us in the auto industry cringed when Geely bought the distinctive Swedish Volvo car brand. However, we were happy years later to find out that while Geely pumped a lot of money into Volvo which helped it revitalization, it also allowed the main design and engineering centers to remain in Sweden so it would not lose certain unique brand traits appreciated by loyal customers. The Chinese can be very cognisant of brand identity and prestige.

Interesting to see a nice update of 'classic' COE still being manufactured. I wish some where there were still updated Mack MH being built

You helped to answer one of my other curious truck questions. Why European Truck makers wound up owning most of America's major truck makers and thus so much more established globally.

Was Mack financial hardship at the time only in the U.S or other markets as well such as Canada and Australia? Exporters seem to have liked older Macks and they were well respected too in countries that weren't originally intended as prime markets for Mack.

These all make sense as they point to changes to the market that Mack may not have readily adapted to. I find especially interesting the point about the demand for integral sleepers, because like you said I did notice that Mack competitors such as Freightliner, Pete/KW and others seemed to have had more 'comfortable' choices for over the road trucks in the late 70s ,80s and onwards. Its probably why it seemed Mack continued to compete better with vocational trucks and day cab tractors in that period than with over the road trucks.

Nice job! The cab looks like the ones used on the Atkinson Borderer.

Wow. I did not realize it was that bad.