rwmindy

The pink is offset by the fact it was owned by a school with the name of TROJANS... which appears in 8 ft. letters on the side of the trailer.

Man, I just realized the pictures never showed the OTHER side of the trailer... probably why b61fred (I mean the ATHS guy) never knew about the 8 ft. TROJAN thing... opps... :-)

I particularly like the trailer.... Now Rob is that truck pink?. You know that you need to comfortable with your masculinity to drive a pink truck.......Ecspecialy one that large!...

The pink is offset by the fact it was owned by a school with the name of TROJANS... which appears in 8 ft. letters on the side of the trailer. Heck, the trailer letters are so big, you hardly notice the pink truck.

My wife was quick to point out that when the connection to the school is lost, that sign really changes the meaning of that trailer. However, I reminded her that the trailer now belongs to some other poor ATHS guy, so they will get to enjoy explaining exactly what they are hauling in the trailer...

which chapter are you a member of if you don't mind me asking?..................Mark

Thanks Mark. I am part of the South Central Indiana chapter.

I do like the idea of the ATHS finding an ultimate home for this truck.

It is a solid truck and a good starting point for someone eventually.

I am not a career trucker, so "apples and oranges" is ok because right now I just need to learn more about fruit.

If I cannot properly back a trailer, at this point, the badge on the front, the type of motor, and tranny is not my personal biggest issue!

This is a good yard / practice truck IMO. As you mentioned, with some minor attention points, I think it holds a lot more for someone eventually that loved these trucks.

Well, I decided to pick-up a trainer truck while my Mack H-67 is being restored. I realize it is not a Mack, but I would rather tear up this 1978 International Transtar II with 1980 Great Dane Trailer while learning so when the Mack arrives it can be properly cared for! After the Mack arrives, it can find a new home.

Also, thanks to members on this board who helped locate this truck, I feel it was a good deal. It was maintained by a school for the last 13+ years of its' life as it carried the band equipment. The school traded it in on a new bus order and, given it was a very large school district, the bus company took it even though they had no idea what to do with a semi and trailer. They just wanted it off the lot. So, total together (truck and trailer) was $2,500. It was also 10 minutes from my house. Hard to pass up when it comes together like that.

The truck is in very good running shape and actually pretty good exterior shape (not much rust). The trailer is pretty solid as well w/ full air, etc. So, seemed like a reasonable investment for a year while getting ready. Apparently the school rebuilt the engine after taking it and the rebuild has low miles. The only thing on it that I could find that did not work was the air conditioner. They even added heated mirrors. It has a Detroit and a Fuller 9 speed. Pretty new air seat to help break in those training hours as well.

I am sure the gears on this truck will pay the ultimate price. Trailer is going to a new home in our local ATHS club. Same member was a great help in getting this pulled together but shall remain nameless (unless he wants to talk about it!).

Here are some pics:

I bought the truck for Paul Van Scott. I bought it and Paul paid me back and he will be restoring it. Im glad its going to a good home also. The cab is all there just has some bad rust in spots but im going to finish cleaning it out today. It was held down by about 100 miles of bryers from where I pulled it out.

Cool. Paul is going to do the restoration on my H model & my trailer for a promo truck... so, by comparison, the H suddenly looks in good shape!

p.s. Paul has been great to work with... (sorry Paul, had to leave at least a little plug for you...)

How much trouble is it to get and maintain an IFTA account?

The fuel tax system is fairly straight forward. It really only requires quarterly reporting and the need to track all your miles in the various states and your fuel receipts.

The state by state interpretation of the "limited plate" clause within the exemptions causes some real diversity in expectations for antique trucks going through several states. Many will consider an antique plated truck to clearly fall within the limited or recreational exemption clauses. However, several reference states not accepting antique plates as an exemption. Overall, compliance to the IFTA rules is completely disconnected from the "commerce" requirements within US DOT and can apply to any truck over 26,000 GVW / GVWR / or GCWR regardless of a commerce connection if a state refuses to accept antique plates as a limited / recreation plated vehicle. So, getting a IFTA account within your state if you plan to cross states often can save you headaches and it is not too difficult or complex.

Once again, people will argue every step you take to look commercial sucks you further into being commercial. However, IFTA never mentions a commercial requirement, it only qualifies vehicles by GVW, etc., and then exempts certain types of vehicles by type. Therefore, IFTA and "commerce" are not really connected in the guidelines like US DOT. They are just connected by "intent" (i.e. I believe the IFTA rules were created thinking it would only really affect commercial trucking - however, they never mention commerce as a requirement).

This is a truck I designed based off the Art Deco era. Yeah the trailer is kinda jacked up so I need to redo it. I want to build this truck. It is a 1938 Dodge COE Tandem Axle with trailer.

I think it looks great. It really captures the time.

I will be there on Saturday with the family.

I can't remember if I posted this before or not, but I recently found some old pics of trucks my grandfather used to drive. I found pics of his H, F and R, but unfortunately couldn't find any of the B he drove for a while.

Love the H! Thanks for posting!

What a nice write up! It shows that you have done all of your homework. You have contacted several sources to compile your information. I do know for a fact that the offical weight for a antique plate in Indiana is 13,000 lbs and no tractor/trailer combos allowed. I have have fought this and have been told by the state registrar to plate the semis as "Cab's" and to ignore the Weight limit of the plate. This was because I pointed out to her that there is no catagory for what I wanted to do with the truck, She agreed, and she came up with the plan. The BMV was quite helpful, when you find the right people.

Morgan

Thanks Morgan (also for all the help!).

I have spent a lot of time pulling together information regarding the use of antique trucks as a hobby and all the potential license & regulation issues one might need to address.

Here is my summary of findings for others looking to find similar data. There are far more experienced people then me with these topics, so hopefully they can add color where they agree or disagree. My intent is to pull together the "collective" information I have found on-line, on the ATHS boards, within my local chapter, within the US DOT, conversations with insurance companies, my BMV, training companies, and various local government sites. Others can add their everyday practical experience to the mix. By no means, is this meant to be the bible over such issues but hopefully saves some people some time looking for similar information.

Summary:

The first thing to understand about these topics is there are no "clear" answers when it comes to antique trucks. There is no one approach or one solution that everyone agrees "meets the requirements" for every situation and state. Regulations vary by state, and frankly, can vary by the DOT officer you might happen to meet on the highway. So, if you want perfectly clear answers that work every time and everywhere, you probably picked the wrong hobby. Also, if you want to receive lots of opinions that differ, open up a subject along any of these lines. That being said, some things do appear to make the most sense for most situations.

Class A CDL License:

In short, get one. Not only is it a great idea to learn something about these large vehicles prior to driving them regularly, most states and most highway officers will "expect" someone driving such a vehicle to have a proper license if it looks just like a commercial truck regardless of the type of plate you are using. I know the ATHS has posted many letters for various states stating the need for a CDL is waived for antique trucks, but this waiver can be contested by any officer on the highway and you will need to fight that ticket in a court potentially miles and miles away from your home. Especially if you plan to travel across state lines, it is just best to have a Class A CDL. Lastly, getting a CDL will provide you tons of information you can leverage in the hobby. Using a private CDL trainer to prep you for your CDL skills exam appears to be the best approach. The large commercial trucking schools are built to get you placed into a commercial truck driving job, not just to train you for a CDL. You can download many study aides to pass the written portion of the test (so no class / instructor is needed for this first part). To be fully covered, get the general, air brake, and combo endorsements and go for a Class A CDL. If you have a love of trucks, you should love getting the training for your CDL, just consider it part of the hobby investment.

DOT Regulations & State Fuel Stickers (non-weigh station related):

In short, all US DOT & state (department of transportation) regulations (log book, DOT #, pre-trip & post trip regs, trip permits, fuel stickers, etc.) are prefaced on being a truck used in commerce. If you are not involved in any form of commerce with your truck, these regulations do not apply. It is up to the DOT office in the state you are passing through to enforce the DOT regulations, therefore, making the case you are not involved in any form of commerce must be clear to a wide range of potential interested parties. States can get very "aggressive" in determining your activity has some commerce connection. Therefore, pulling race cars to an event where prize money could be involved, truck shows with prize money, selling antique trucks that are on the trailer, showing any form of corporate sponsorship on the truck (promotion), pulling horses you commonly sell, etc., can all be tied to the commerce clause in any given state. Therefore, it is critical if you do not comply with all the DOT regulations you remove any form of commerce connection to your truck and your activity. When asked, you must have your story completely straight with the clear indication "My driving this truck serves ZERO commercial interest. This truck is not involved in any form of commerce and is just being used as part of my personal hobby". "Not for Hire" is a term used often by "For Hire" trucks when making "Not for Hire" legs or by private trucks that still have some underlying commercial purpose but are not hired out to other companies (i.e. promotional trucks). Therefore, be careful with this designation. It is better to make it clear the truck is never used in commerce then it is to make the argument this particular leg of a trip is "not for hire". "Not for Hire" does not mean the truck has no commercial connection. The later is what you need to prove or be prepared to argue if you want to bypass all DOT requirements. I would recommend the following magnetic sign on the door of the truck (or something similar):

Private Antique Truck

No Commerce Involved (Personal Use Only)

CDL Licensed Driver

Weigh Stations:

On the whole, just go through them (i.e. do not try and pass by them). Some will specifically call out "commercial vehicles" which might provide you some reason to pass. However, most just call out just a weight criteria. From everything I have read and discussed, it is best just to go through the station. Virtually all the time, upon seeing your setup, they will waive you through. The irony is, sometimes, they might even yell out you for going through (such is our system of government and the variance between operators in the states). However, on the whole, you are more likely to have a side of the road conversation with a patrol car if you pass by then if you pass through. If they are yelling at you to keep moving, at least they keep you moving.

Type of Plate:

There are really three possible outcomes for your plate decision and all vary by state (potentially greatly) in terms of underlying criteria. You can put on regular truck plates, antique truck plates, and potentially RV plates. Unfortunately, all come with some potential issues. I have more data on Indiana here because that is my focus area. This one, I am afraid, needs local support to get right. However, as a general rule:

Regular truck plates give you the potential broadest use of the vehicle with least restrictions. However, it also makes you a prime target for appearing to be a vehicle used in commerce (see above). They are also the most expensive. In fact, some will argue you can only use a regular commercial plate if you are involved in commerce; therefore, this decision becomes mutually exclusive to deciding not to follow DOT regulations in the eyes of some states. Frankly, it is a mess. The reality is if you put a regular truck plate on your antique truck, you should probably be prepared to follow all the DOT regulations depending on your state. Frankly, the commercial truck plate will probably make your non-commerce argument all the more tenuous (but not impossible). The upside being, within the DOT regulations, you can use your truck for most anything.

Antique truck plates vary greatly by state in terms of restrictions. Some states will refuse to provide them for vehicles over a certain weight. Some provide them, but they come with lots of restrictions in terms of use. This is where you need to understand your state requirements the most. Often, if you can get them, they are the best plate for your truck because it indicates to most third parties you are a non-commerce related truck and gives you more support for not following all the DOT regulations. You just have to decide if you can live with your state specific restrictions (or, more likely, accept the lack of enforcement of most of these restrictions). Indiana, from everything I can find, does not highly limit the use of an antique truck plated vehicle. However, you might need the local support of the ATHS.ORG groups to get it registered because some BMVs will argue a weight limit for the truck. However, most members have gotten past this issue. So, for Indiana, this appears to be the best route.

RV plates are also an option. Once again, every state will have its own criteria for what they consider an "RV". Some allow just about anything and some have a 4 or 5 point requirements check list. You just need to research it and make sure your truck follows the criteria. Some have had great success with RV plates because they rarely come with use restrictions and they have clear exemptions in most state regulations. However, I have heard several stories of local DOT enforcement officers literally "ripping up" your RV registration and calling it a farce because the truck appears commercial (i.e. they contest the registration). Therefore, even getting these plates can cause some states to "question" you because they feel you are "pulling a fast one". So, it comes with its' own unique risks & problems even if you qualify in your state (especially if the truck is only mildly modified to meet the criteria). Again, in the worse case, if you have an officer that decides to fight the registration, you can probably win it back in traffic court, but it might be a long way from home to do it.

Overall, picking the right plate can be a real mess. Learn your state rules, talk to your local chapter of the ATHS or ATCA, and they can guide you to the best answer.

Insurance:

There are two basic approaches to insurance. You can go the "collector" insurance route or regular truck insurance route. Again, different insurance companies will treat your vehicle differently, so the "regular truck" route must be researched with your insurance company.

The two main collector insurance companies that appear to be used are Hagerty and Gulfway. I am sure there are more, but these come up the most when discussing antique truck insurance. The main difference is Hagerty will only allow towing if you get a "special" exception approved by the underwriters and the criteria is very strict (matching antique car, etc.). Some say you cannot get it all through Hagerty (which is not the case), it is just very restrictive and limited. Therefore, most have not gotten towing coverage through Hagerty. Gulfway will cover a trailer & towing insured by them but excludes travel trailers from their tow list (so you can pull a historic truck trailer, but not your RV travel trailer). You might be able to tow an antique travel trailer, but I have not tried that approach with them yet. Frankly, I find both were very restrictive, but also relatively cheap. If you can live with the restrictions, they are a very good option.

Regular truck insurance can be a hornets’ nest with your insurance company, but often leads to the most flexible and useful coverage. It will probably be more expensive. It is very much worth your time to work through your regular insurance company if you want lots of latitude in your use and towing. Be sure to let them know if you plan on having antique plates on the truck because that might affect their insurance options. Frustrating, but some might not take your truck with antique plates, which causes a terrible ripple effect to get the insurance you need (i.e. might need regular truck plates, which brings potential DOT problems, etc.). If this is the case, getting the best towing coverage via a collector insurance company might be the best approach and compromise.

Lastly:

The best combination of title, license, plate, insurance, DOT compliance, etc., is more complex than any hobby should demand, but, unfortunately, it reflects the hobby we have selected. For a specific state, and a specific usage goal, a formula can always be created that provides the best possible compliance and coverage at a reasonable investment of time and money. In the end, you should not underestimate the potential need for "people skills" to work your way through this process and through a potential traffic stop should it occur under the best of circumstances. After all, antique trucks are still a people business

Thought I would share these pictures of an old White truck turned into a hot rod. Very strange!

I have no idea about the specs on the truck, it is for sale in Peoria, IL and my father in law just took a few photos.

Seeing the 4 stacks, I am not thinking this was just for show... there is probably some go here as well.

Believe it or not,an automatic could be ordered in a B model,but if you ask me,that would be about like buying a case of empty beer cans.The main thing you gotta remember when considering a transmission swap such as an automatic or even going to a 5 speed,you're going to have to consider your rears too or you might end up with a 40 mph truck.

It appears switching to an Allison will be a major re-think of the engine / tranny / rears / mounting locations / etc.

The good news is, all options are still possible because the truck has not even been torn down yet.

Hopefully I will have a direction for the entire drive line in the next 3-4 weeks.

I would not attempt anything this ambitious on my own.

if anybody has a 285 hp Maxidyne that they've done any tweeks on or made improvements to it for more power.

Ok Tony, now I see you want to win the "slow truck" H drag race because "first to street" award in the H series show down is in jeopardy given my potential outsourcing plan

Just remember, however, when you are trying to grab about 10 double clutch shifts in this thing to get out of the hole worrying you might grenade the tranny, I might just be pressing the accelerator and letting the magic of Allison run right past you regardless of how many horses you squeeze under your cab!

Sure, I am a wimp thinking about an Allison (this is for the general board audience - Tony supports the 'the title is in your name - do what you want plan'), but I will be a wimp with a smile during the "slow truck" H drag race I bet.

A 237 & 5 $peed probably make$ more $en$e unle$$ you got lot$ of the$e!!!

Yup. The 5 sp. is certainly on the list of possibles (and a good one).

I am just seeing how far I might be able to take it... with the Allison being a possible consideration.

$$ is expected. However, at this point, I am not even sure what would work (especially using a Mack engine).

Hi,

Was wondering if anyone had success getting an older Mack engine to work with an Allison auto in a B or H model truck?

Wondering if there are proven combos of the two that are out there working in one of these older trucks.

If so, just curious what the engine / tranny model that worked and how much fabrication was needed to get it to happen!

Thanks!

Rob

p.s. Yes, I am considering making a "lazy man" model out of my H series. Love the look and want to restore to original appearance but might put a modern drive train under her to make it a real easy hauler for the family. This is just data gathering.

Here is a 1938 mack model EC,this was one of 123 built between 1936 and 1941, most of which were moving vans like this one......mark

Very nice. There appears to have been a few years in the early thirties where many brewing companies started producing streamlined versions of their delivery trucks. I am guessing someone grabbed some attention with one and, as many industries go, competitors started copying the effort.

I am also guessing the war came and this came to an abrupt stop. By the time we exit the war, art deco has passed and the streamliner look disappears.

There appears to be very few of the streamliner beer trucks left around.

However, they are awesome. What a collection this would make for some crazy person.

Wait a second, I am a crazy person :-) I mean a crazy, wealthy person.

For this collection, I am guessing just crazy will not get it done.

Labatts's Breweries had a couple all restored that they used for shows, but I haven't seen one since back in the 80's I don't know if they have one still or not.

Big Dog you inspired me to look further. Labatt's is "da bomb" in streamliners.

Here are some more photos. Of course, now I am hooked.

First one to find a Streamliner not restored... I am buyer

Well done! Like the new look and several things already appear easier to do!

Labatt's beer in canada had a White tractor trailer in the thirties that they called the White Streamliner. They had a steamlined cab and matching trailer like that.

Perhaps one of our Canadian members could locate one of these trucks!

They need to see the road again.

I personally feel these could be the "Duesenbergs" of antique trucks. However, more rare.

People love the art deco period... and these trucks capture the spirit of that period as well as anything else out there.

Thanks for all the replies.

We went to the local cruise night and the Mack was a real crowd pleaser.

I've been driving some nice old cars for a long time now but nothing seems to get peoples attention like the old B model does.

[Jim

Jim, just wanted to pass along my quick "wow". What a great job. Fantastic. Of course, having done nothing but purchase a truck needing everything, I am not sure such compliments come with much weight as compared to others around this board. However, I offer them none the less.

-Rob

Are they still in bussiness?

It merged into another brewing company that then disappeared... so I lost the trail.

However, another streamlined trailer was found in the hunt.

Boy, these Canadian brewing companies were on it in terms of style...

Wow. Talk about your white whales. I would love to find / see this classic Mack.

Does this truck still exist?

If not, what a barn find this would be!

Of course, restoration cost would be hard to calculate.

Given there were only 123 EC trucks built in the first place and probably only one was streamlined.

The Mack 1937 EC Streamlined

Hi rob, glad to hear you sealed the deal on the H-model! sure looks like a good solid starting point. I don't know if you are aware of this,but wood brothers moving and storage is still in existance,i was leased to atlas van lines for almost 20 years,they are one of the oldest moving companies in new england and are agents for atlas it may be worthwhile to contact them,see if any of the trucks history can be learned,maybe even photo or 2 can be found when it was new, my thinking is that it can't hurt.Wood brothers ran predominately macks,but used other make trucks as well..mark wood brothers moving and storage

3607 lafayette road

portsmouth,NH 03801 (603) 319-4096

www.woodbrosmoving.com

Fantastic. I will absolutely reach out to them.

Hey there, my name is Keith and I have several H model. I will have a Landoll Trailer in Kennebunk, Me in the next 2-3 weeks. Kennebunk is only about 40 miles from union. I would be happy to transport this truck for you. My phone number is (804)640-8425. Give me a call and we can discuss price. Thanks, Keith.

Thanks Keith. I really appreciate the offer. I was literally coming to this listing to provide an update. The truck is taking a detour to a potential restoration business. They will be picking it up.

So it looks like the next trip for the truck will be covered.

Again, thanks, and sorry I missed the update prior to your post.

-Rob