Mack log truck

I have been fighting an issue with my 1995 CL 713, E7 427 currently Vmac1.

A few years ago had the FIC module go bad and the truck would shut off intermittently with no warning and throw codes 6-2 and 6-3 (it was like that from the day I bought it). I putba new FIC module in it and immediately solved the issue, now it's doing the same thing and all signs lead to my FIC module has the same issue, it ran fine for 3 years, about 1000hrs(part time truck). The mack dealer is looking into converting from Vmac1 to Vmac2, has anyone here done it? Is it "easy"? I don't want to keep throwing FIC modules at this thing.... Thank you for any input.

On 3/4/2022 at 6:47 PM, Joey Mack said:

yes

Jojo, the starter relay is just a 3 post intermittent 12v relay you can buy at an auto parts store or should it have specific specs? 

On 2/24/2022 at 8:41 PM, Joey Mack said:

"Fix what you know is broke!"   Jojo

Hey jojo, I fixed those two damaged wires. When I cut them to repair and basically removed power to the fic module I turned the key on to see what codes I would get and got both blink codes 6-2 & 6-3, just like I do when thr truck shuts off. Soldered everything back together and it shut off again this morning when I was sitting in the truck. The electronic Malfunction light came on, I sat there for about 15-20 sec and the light went out and it fired up. 

It must be in that circuit? The only time I have ever gotten those two codes is when I cut those power wires and when I removed the fuse that sends power to the fic module. 

Any ideas of what I could try? I pulled out the shutdown relay that is between the fic module and the fuel rack actuator, turned the key on and that didn't throw a code so I don't think I am losing power to the fuel rack actuator. this has me scratching my head... could be a pin at the fic module connector or in the fic module... I don't want to keep throwing modules at it, I don't think Mack is going to help me at all with the fic module.

Idle operation temp. @700rpm it's at 20psi

@1450rmp, 55mph it is between 40-45psi oil pressure 

Not to change topics but I was under the truck and noticed some coolant on the surface of the lower tank and dripping off. If I pull the radiator can just a  new lower tank be installed without getting to complicated? I can't tell for sure if it's coming from the gasket or coming through the metal but the lower tank is pretty rusty. 

1 hour ago, MACKS said:

If that fuel line between the heads is leaking I’m betting it starts a little hard after sitting a day or two..

If that's a fuel line it must not be leaking because it's oil that i see, so must be from the valve covers? It starts great no matter how long it sits or 5-10 degree Temps. It has always started great, little bit of blue haze out of the exhaust but doesn't smoke once it's warm or under load. 

Just now, Joey Mack said:

the picture is not wide enough for me...  I think the oil on the spring is coming from the steering box and not the overboard breather..  I bet it runs fine, just needs more frequent maintenance,  if hes not going to roll rods and mains and a new oil pump...  jojo

I'll do oil changes more often, 2/3 of the hrs are @ 1,900hrs while running the log loader but I have no problem changing oil. And yes the steering boxes leak. It leaks oil at the small tube between the two valve covers, I'd like to fix that, what exactly is that doing? 

1 minute ago, mechohaulic said:

what type of maintance are you doing to it  in terms of oil change intervals?  blow -by not an issue . possibly shorten the oil change interval  up grade oil type with hopes of raising oil pressure.

I do oil changes on my diesel engines every 250hrs. I shoot for 200-250hrs but usually ends up nearer to 250.

5 minutes ago, Joey Mack said:

right.... but the connection itself is not a fused link..  so cut it, and remove the bad wire approx. 1/2" of wire, and solder in good wire if there is not enough to make the connection's....  jojo  

Thank you again, hopefully this will solve my issue. 🤞

2 hours ago, Joey Mack said:

I think its bit too much blowby, and the low oil pressure when warmed up.  20+ would make me feel better..  when was the last time the oil pump was re[laced, as well as rod and main bearings?  the blowby is usually worn rings, I have done rods and mains and an oil pump several times to help improve oil pressure..  Of course I didnt do cam bushings, due to cust. budget or request...  it does help.  I also check the welch plugs in the rocker arm shafts to make sure one is not leaking by or popped out..  ive made that repair a few times...  there will be more comments on the way..  one of us will help you... jojo

I have not touched the engine and i dont know the history. I bought it 6 years ago when it had 19,000hrs and have put about 2,000hrs and about 10,000 miles on it. It starts good, has a little blueish smoke when it's cold but doesn't blow smoke under load as far as I can tell while operating. If there is "upkeep engine maintenance" I can do or have a mechanic look into that aren't huge expences I'd like to pursue them.

2 hours ago, Joey Mack said:

I believe, I would cut them to a clean spot and solder in new wire. I would also slide a heat shrink on the wires before I solder them.. I dont think that is a fused link, I believe it is just 2 wires into 1, under the heatshrink.. jojo

Under the heat shrink it's 2 wires, one goes to fuse and the other goes to the engine shutdown relay in the fuse box

Curious what your guy thoughts are on this amount of blowby. 

1995 cl713 e7 427. It's a log truck so gets quite of loader time running around 1900rpm. Currently shows 21,100hrs. Has around 60psi oil pressure at startup idle, slightly under 20psi oil pressure at 170-180deg idle. Little bit of oil hase coming out of the tube. 

Thanks in advance 

13 hours ago, Joey Mack said:

 wish you well... I believe it s a wiring issue, and possibly a bad ground or 2+... jojo

I just discovered this, Crack in both wires that come from the fuse box and power the fic module. 

What do you recommend for the best repair on these wires? 

12 hours ago, Joey Mack said:

 wish you well... I believe it s a wiring issue, and possibly a bad ground or 2+... jojo

I took the sensor on the bell housing out. It was adjusted properly, I wiped off the tip because it was a little gummy. 

Here's my injection pump 

6 minutes ago, Joey Mack said:

 wish you well... I believe it s a wiring issue, and possibly a bad ground or 2+... jojo

I appreciate it, ill see how everything looks tomorrow. 

12 minutes ago, Joey Mack said:

have you set the sensor in the flywheel housing correctly?  all the way in til it touches, then 1 turn out...? same for the speed sensor at the tranny tail shaft...   jojo

I have not but I can tomorrow, a friend is letting me use his shop for the day to look over the truck. Today I wiggled wires on the engine side, plugs, fuzes, anything electrical. Nothing has ever duplicated the symptoms

37 minutes ago, Joey Mack said:

do you have a robert bosch  7100 pump? send a pic.... 

It's a bosch pump with the econovance if that helps. I can take a picture of it tomorrow 

33 minutes ago, Joey Mack said:

OK.  I am curious why you may need another FIC module..  but.... if that what gets you going for a few years,  then I guess that's it..  You have one hell of a truck!!!  Keep it rollin...  jojo

Honestly I'm at a loss of ideas. Code 6-2 is a proprietary data line and 6-3 is a sae/Ata serial line. I want to rule everything out before getting a fic module. I'm looking at my book now and 6-2 code will come up with injection timing, 6-3 will come up with speed control ( I've only been noticing the truck "hiccup" or shutoff when the speedcontrol is in the on position.) This is driving me crazy, I'm on my own local Mack dealer useless.

2 minutes ago, Joey Mack said:

I forgot...  did we talk about the sensor in the flywheel housing?  jojo

Yes, I disconnected that sensor today and my rpm Guage quit working and that was all. 

1 minute ago, Joey Mack said:

You seem to have a damn good skill set..  I wonder if there is a bad spot in the wiring to the injection pump..  I assume you have checked them, Do you have an E-7 book?  if not, i do and can try to find the flow chart to fix this issue...  jojo

I wonder about a bad wire or the connector at the module but then I remember how a new module 4 years ago instantly solved the issue and now it's coming back. The only thing I can think of is I have another issue somewhere that fried my first module and has now done the same to this one 4 years later(I don't know enough to know what could cause that) but it's identical to the issues with the previous module. 

I have a wire diagram and the v-mac book for troubleshooting blink codes and all that but that's all I have.

I also pulled the plug apart at the injection pump and it threw 2 separate codes from what I experience so I think I can rule any of that wiring out. And I pulled the fuse to the v-mac module and I couldn't check the codes because the electronic Malfunction light and shutdown light was on. 

On 2/16/2022 at 7:49 AM, Joey Mack said:

yes  

Today it did it again and threw codes 6-2 and 6-3, exactly the same as it did 4 years ago. I let the truck sit for a couple mins with the key on, the electronic Malfunction light went out and it fired up. It doest ever start until the electronic Malfunction light goes out. 

So I looked at the wire diagram more and pulled of the fuse that sends power to the bosch (fuel injection control) module, turned the key on and had blink codes 6-2 and 6-3, identical to when it shuts off. So I figure I either have a junk module again or I'm losing power to the module. Given the fact that it's been fine for 4 years now acting up I'm leaning towards the module which pisses me off! 

1 hour ago, Joey Mack said:

Hey Bud, can you specify the issue.  The post is 6 years old and I think it would be helpful to have current info..  Lots of smart guys here to help you. jojo

Hi Jojo, you commented on my last post about my 1995 cl713 shutting down intermittently. Today it did it again and threw codes 6-2 and 6-3, exactly the same as it did 4 years ago. I let the truck sit for a couple mins with the key on, the electronic Malfunction light went out and it fired up. It doest ever start until the electronic Malfunction light goes out. 

So I looked at the wire diagram more and pulled of the fuse that sends power to the bosch (fuel injection control) module, turned the key on and had blink codes 6-2 and 6-3, identical to when it shuts off. So I figure I either have a junk module again or I'm losing power to the module. Given the fact that it's been fine for 4 years now acting up I'm leaning towards the module which pisses me off! 

Did you fix your problem, I am having the same issue, and had the same issue 4 years ago until I replaced the fic module 

On 9/12/2020 at 7:48 PM, CTS2 said:

I have a 1994 model CHR with EN7-400 V-MAC engine. 

Occasionally the engine will shut down, without warning, for no reason. 

When it happens, I get two fault codes:

6-2 Date Line Input (Proprietary) no signal.

6-3 SAE/ATA J1708 Serial Line No Signal. 

If it shuts down while driving, turning the key off and then on again will often reset it, and while in motion it will roll start. But sometimes it won't, and you have to start it with the starter motor. Which is normally not ideal to do while trying to drive, corner, in traffic, etc.

I have been given the troubleshooting chart for the two codes from Mack. But the trouble is, that when it is in the workshop, the fault codes are not present, and the tests all show that it is all working properly. If it shuts down in a convenient place in the yard, I can run the tests, but the steps say that you have to turn off the key before unplugging the loom from the ECM, and doing this always resets it and then there is nothing wrong again. 

There is no pattern to the random shut downs - hot day, cold day, pulling hard, pulling light, coasting, engine brake on, engine brake off, top gear, middle gear, occasionally during a gearshift, occasionally while idling. 

Sometimes it may do hundreds of kilometres without fault, then do it a few times within a couple of hours. It's rather annoying. 

I have checked over the loom visually, and repaired a couple of slightly rubbed wires, replaced a pin in the ECM connector, but it is very difficult to access all of the loom.

Any suggestions? Any problem spots in the loom that I may not be aware of? 

On 4/13/2014 at 10:36 AM, turckster said:

Code 6-2:

Failure Mode Identifier (FMI): 0 (Data Valid, but Greater Than Normal), 1 (Data Valid, but Less Than Normal), 3 (Voltage High), 4 (Voltage Low), 5 (Current Low/Open), 8 (Abnormal)

Parameter Identification (PID): P103

Message Identification (MID): 128

Circuit Description: The Turbocharger Wheel Speed (TWS) Sensor is an inductive sensor. When the engine is running, the turbocharger shaft rotates past the TWS Sensor tip and a pulsed voltage signal is generated. The Engine Electronic Control Unit monitors the frequency of the signal generated by the TWS Sensor to calculate the turbo speed.

Code Setting Conditions: If the Engine Electronic Control Unit (EECU) detects an open, short to ground or short to voltage in the Turbocharger Wheel Speed (TWS) sensor signal circuit, the Electronic Malfunction Lamp (EML) will turn ON and blink code 6-2 will set. Code 6-2 will also set if the turbocharger wheel speed is not within the predetermined limits at a given engine speed.

Location: The Turbocharger Wheel Speed (TWS) Sensor is located on the right side of the engine, mounted in the turbocharger.

Normal TWS Sensor Parameters: The Turbocharger Wheel Speed (TWS) Sensor has a resistance of 638–1062 ohms.

Additional Symptoms: Power is reduced if the TWS Sensor signal indicates shaft speed in excess of 112,000 rpm at sea level or 120,000 rpm at 5000 feet (1524 meters).

 

Code 6-3:

Failure Mode Identifier (FMI): 8 (Abnormal)

Parameter Identification (PID): S250

Message Identification (MID): 128, 142

Circuit Description: The J1587 serial data lines are used as the standard communication link for on-board vehicle instrumentation and off-board service diagnostics and fleet management. The V-MAC® III control units broadcast data across the J1587 serial data lines to operate electronic instrumentation, the electronic gauge panel, and the Co-Pilot display, and to communicate with the ABS, Allison Transmission and Eaton Transmission control units, depending upon the vehicle model and options. The diagnostic computer communicates with the V-MAC® III control units through the J1587 Serial Communications Port.

Location: The Serial Communications Port is located under the dash, to the left of the steering column.

Code Setting Conditions: If either the Vehicle Electronic Control Unit (VECU) or the Engine Electronic Control Unit (EECU) loses communication through the J1587 serial data lines for more than 1 second, code 6-3 will set and the Electronic Malfunction Lamp (EML) will turn ON. The fault will become inactive if communication resumes for at least 1 second.

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If code 6-3 sets intermittently or is accompanied by other fault codes, check for secure connections at the 135 amp ground circuit breaker posts. The ground circuit breaker is located on the left side of the bulkhead.

I am still having this issue with my 1995 cl713 e7 427