Very Dirty 289 Ford

[Red Horse 1,583]

Well not sure where to post this...in any case, I know there are a lot of very knowledgeable gearheads out there so here goes.  Have the trans/transfer case out of my 68 Bronco as well as clutch.  Then for sure rear main is leaking so ad that to list.  My son  then says.."you can't leave those valve covers on" so what a mess that revealed.  You would not believe the sludge in that thing. Again a 68 289 that has about 64,000 miles on it.  I bought it in like 94 and then  it sat in my barn from 98 until now.  I always used 10-30 GulfPride but previous owners probably were using 30w.

Any suggestion as to best way to do a reasonable cleanout of top end.  Couple of guys have suggested .."leave it alone".  The screen on the oil pick up looks good.

Note I said "reasonable"-I'm not taking that motor out.  

Appreciate any suggestions

[carlotpilot 1,467]

if it was mine i would take the plug out of the oil pan and start pouring diesel or kerosene  over the heads  let that run  out in a pan , soak it down real good then take my pressure washer to it . let it all run out the botton blow it dry and put oil back in. maybe some purple power in there after the kero.

[tjc transport 1,138]

^^^ this^^^

it works a lot better than you would believe.

[Freightrain 2,501]

Not really sure I would mess with it.  Just run decent oil, change the filter a few times after getting some miles on it.  I'm not sure you want to break all that crap loose and have it floating around in one big mess.  With good detergent oil, over time, may clean some of it up.  If you can "pick" some of the bigger pieces out, do so, but I wouldn't got crazy.

If it runs okay and has decent oil pressure........just run it.

[1965 407]

If I had trans out, I’d pull the motor mount bolts and replace all the gaskets and seals & hone, new bearings & rings and be done.

[RoadwayR 296]

I have had some success cleaning sludged up engines with Rislone.  I changed the oil and filter, added Rislone, drove for a week and repeated 2 or 3 times.  The problem is you run the risk of loosening sludge up and having it jamb up the oil pump or plugging the oil pickup.  Also if you do manage to clean the engine out, you might find that sludge was doing a pretty good job of plugging up leaky gaskets, and now that it's gone.....

That having been said, I have seen a number of old untouched Ford 289's and 302's with low miles suddenly loose oil pressure due to pieces of the nylon cam sprocket and/or valve guide seals lock up the oil pump.  I think 'Freightrain' and '1965' are both right, either leave it alone or pull the engine and freshen it up.  

[Red Horse 1,583]

6 hours ago, tjc transport said:

^^^ this^^^

it works a lot better than you would believe.

TJC....?????

[tjc transport 1,138]

i meant the post above mine. flush it out with diesel or kerosene and then give it a good washing with a hot water pressure washer while it is apart for reseal. 

[Truck Shop 1,502]

All of that said-what kind of white/gray teflon goo was in the bottom of the oil pan? I would be willing to bet if the intake was removed you

would find a layer or brick of carbon/sludge under there. I worked auto machine years ago-machined tons of ford blocks and heads of all

types along with every other engine type. The oils in those days were full of teflon and it separated out real quick especially with short 

distance driving and aided in a crust forming in areas of low oil flow. I have removed valve covers and intakes from engines that had what

would be another valve cover underneath that was solid crust same in the lifter galley. The bad thing is {I would bet} the cam and lifters are

getting tired {probably can't even remove lifters without vise gripes and a case of carb clean}. Now that rear main leak-small block fords

with manual transmissions/clutch have a tendency to wear the main shaft thrust bearings when oil is really filthy, and a many engines back

then suffered from that problem. So you will want to check the crank real good, Plus the valve stem umbrella seals are probably cracked

or broken to bits. 1965 has a good idea.    

[Truck Shop 1,502]

The 289 in this photo of a custom CJ3B I built in the 80's was a prime example of a completely crusted engine inside. It had 85,000 miles

on it, came out of a 66 4dr Fairlane. The bore stroke on a 289 is 4"x 2 3/4" and will taper bad with a bunch of ridge, this one barely cleaned

up at .040 over on it's first bore, it still had a few smileys in the bore but were not in the ring travel area. But 289's and 302's were good engines.

 

 

[h67st 1,169]

I bought a 66 Fairlane years ago with a spun bearing, it had sucked up a chunk of brittle valve seal into the oil pump and twisted the oil pump hex shaft in two.

[Red Horse 1,583]

Thx guys  for all the responses.  All good info-stay tuned.  By the way, this 68's original owner was a rural mail carrier in PA. Per second owner who was a relative, day he got it he pulled the back seat and left it in plastic bag.  I am I think 4th or 5th owner-I knew for sure at one time🤪-when I got it seat was loose in back and in a plastic bag. Talk about stop and go!

[topo 30]

In the mid 80's I bought a 53 GMC with a 302  and when replacing a leaking valve cover gasket I found a very dirty top end the engine had been rebuilt in the 70's   . Then a few years back it started leaking antifreeze and needed a head gasket I removed the valve cover and the top end was clean very clean I pulled the side cover the lifter also clean I had the valves done when  the head was off  then put it all back together  I never scraped or wire brushed anything it was so clean  the only oil I had used as Rotella 15-40 

[doubleclutchinweasel 521]

In  my experience, putting a good high-detergent oil in, running the engine enough to get it hot, and changing the oil regularly WILL clean a great deal of gunk out...over time.

Can't overemphasize how much heat helps.  Around-town engines that never get good and hot tend to build up a lot more sludge.  Ones that run long distances at higher temps tend to run cleaner.  And, good oil is a must.  Back when the world was young, and so was I, there were a couple of commonly-used oils which tended to gunk up more than others.  Most oils today are far better than anything we had back then.

Your results may vary...

[mowerman 2,111]

Personally I would remove heads and have them gone through and replace the leaking seal .... valves been sitting that long probably at least need lapping and new valve guide seals plus you can do that yourself then dip heads in zep parts dip drum 5 gallon pail... good luck.. your internal engine parts should be fine with that small mileage . bob

[Mark T 48]

ATF works if you don't mind having everything loosened up and pumped through the engine. If you're careful and change the oil and filter a couple times there's a slim chance.  Nothing is a quick fix other than rebuilding it.  With modern oils and a nice hot ignition ? it'll probably never happen again.

[Bullheaded 1,010]

1 hour ago, Mark T said:

ATF works if you don't mind having everything loosened up and pumped through the engine. If you're careful and change the oil and filter a couple times there's a slim chance.  Nothing is a quick fix other than rebuilding it.  With modern oils and a nice hot ignition ? it'll probably never happen again.

This is all I have ever done. Throw a quart of ATF in it, take it for a good run and get it hot, then drain and change filter.

 

I love 289's. Very good engine. Had a couple in Mustangs.

[other dog 8,992]

On 12/2/2020 at 2:37 PM, doubleclutchinweasel said:

In  my experience, putting a good high-detergent oil in, running the engine enough to get it hot, and changing the oil regularly WILL clean a great deal of gunk out...over time.

Can't overemphasize how much heat helps.  Around-town engines that never get good and hot tend to build up a lot more sludge.  Ones that run long distances at higher temps tend to run cleaner.  And, good oil is a must.  Back when the world was young, and so was I, there were a couple of commonly-used oils which tended to gunk up more than others.  Most oils today are far better than anything we had back then.

Your results may vary...

When I was a kid- yeah, it's been a while- my Dad always used Quaker State oil. I don't know how the 292 engine in his Chevrolet pickup looked on the inside, or the 327 in Ma's Impala either, but as I got older I heard more than one person say that Quaker State oil would gum your engine up. And it may not have been any worse than any other oil, but I didn't take any chances with it, I used Pennzoil. Still use Pennzoil, but I use the Pennzoil Platinum synthetic oil now.

[Freightrain 2,501]

I always used the term "Quaker Sludge" to describe that oil.  Haven't used it in many decades.  From what I heard it had too much parafin wax in it, thus it got gummy and clogged everything up.

Edited December 15, 2020 by Freightrain

[doubleclutchinweasel 521]

Yeah, I wouldn’t use Quaker State either. Lots of folks did. But I took too many apart that were gummed up. I think it was okay if you got it hot regularly. But, around-town-mobiles seemed particularly bad to gum up with it. 

[mowerman 2,111]

im a firm believer of changing oil regularly  especially  in lawn mowers....bob