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    Guest Message by DevFuse
     

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    Installing Endt 676 In B-75



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    28 replies to this topic

    #1 OFFLINE   workingbmodels

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    Posted 26 December 2009 - 11:07 AM

    How to work around the fact that the steering colum on a B-75 conflicts with the spin on oil filters on a 676 engine. Some opinions say just us (one) tall oil filter and one short filter. Others say not enough adequate filtration when done this way. Have also been told both engines are a full flow/by pass arrangement so therefore continue using the original luber-finer arrangement as equiped. I realize the spin on base plate will have to be removed from the oil cooler and in place the fittings and hoses will have to be installed leading to the luber-finer mounted infront of the driver's side 70 gal. fuel tank. May also have to change gaskets on check valve plate that bolts to engine block. Any one ever experienced any of this? Please reply with anything that might help. Thanks.....

    #2 OFFLINE   theakerstwo

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    Posted 26 December 2009 - 11:51 AM

    How to work around the fact that the steering colum on a B-75 conflicts with the spin on oil filters on a 676 engine. Some opinions say just us (one) tall oil filter and one short filter. Others say not enough adequate filtration when done this way. Have also been told both engines are a full flow/by pass arrangement so therefore continue using the original luber-finer arrangement as equiped. I realize the spin on base plate will have to be removed from the oil cooler and in place the fittings and hoses will have to be installed leading to the luber-finer mounted infront of the driver's side 70 gal. fuel tank. May also have to change gaskets on check valve plate that bolts to engine block. Any one ever experienced any of this? Please reply with anything that might help. Thanks.....

    I cut my teeth on those engines and trucks. First you do not want to change the base plate or regulator valve body that bolts to the block with 4 bolts. Or at lest back to the plate that uses two small oil lines. Your engine will use a set up of two screw on full flow oil filters or a set up of two full flow and one partial/flow by/pass filter.If you change to a single remote lubfiner which the older 673 used before the full flow and that was a 500 luber finer then you will have brg damage real fast. I have never been around the B75 with the spin on filter install so cant help there. I have a B61 with the two full flow screw on on it and it is not a problem for the ssteer box.If you have a three filter set up and it is in the way of the steer box then look into the two filter set up with the base pressure regulator block to go with it.The thrird filter may be the problem with your steer box. The two filter set up looks like the three filter set up all but the middle out side filter is taken off. It is the by/pass filter.
    glenn akers

    #3 OFFLINE   workingbmodels

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    Posted 26 December 2009 - 12:54 PM

    I cut my teeth on those engines and trucks. First you do not want to change the base plate or regulator valve body that bolts to the block with 4 bolts. Or at lest back to the plate that uses two small oil lines. Your engine will use a set up of two screw on full flow oil filters or a set up of two full flow and one partial/flow by/pass filter.If you change to a single remote lubfiner which the older 673 used before the full flow and that was a 500 luber finer then you will have brg damage real fast. I have never been around the B75 with the spin on filter install so cant help there. I have a B61 with the two full flow screw on on it and it is not a problem for the ssteer box.If you have a three filter set up and it is in the way of the steer box then look into the two filter set up with the base pressure regulator block to go with it.The thrird filter may be the problem with your steer box. The two filter set up looks like the three filter set up all but the middle out side filter is taken off. It is the by/pass filter.

    Thanks for your response! I don't have small lines. I have two large lines at either end of the oiler cooler going to the luber-finer and one small line from luber-finer going into to engine block. Also I only have a two filter spin on base plate. Never got to the point to try and set it in yet. Just have been told it will hit steering colum. Hmm..? Marc

    #4 OFFLINE   Rob

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    Posted 26 December 2009 - 03:04 PM

    Thanks for your response! I don't have small lines. I have two large lines at either end of the oiler cooler going to the luber-finer and one small line from luber-finer going into to engine block. Also I only have a two filter spin on base plate. Never got to the point to try and set it in yet. Just have been told it will hit steering colum. Hmm..? Marc


    If you are going to a two filter setup do you need to retain the Luberfiner for other than looks? The engine was not built with a bypass type filter so it may not be necessary.

    I like the looks of them myself when they are not all rusty and would leave the cannister in place for cosmetics.

    Rob

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    #5 OFFLINE   HK Trucking

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    Posted 26 December 2009 - 04:01 PM

    Sounds to me like he's not talking about a luberfiner, but a full flow/bypass Mack filter, also known as the "duplex clarifier", that would have the large oil lines running to it.



    I've seen those occasionally mounted remotely on the outside of the truck, usually on the frame rail just behind the cab.
    "If You Can't Shift It Smoothly, You Shouldn't Be Driving It"

    #6 OFFLINE   workingbmodels

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    Posted 26 December 2009 - 05:01 PM

    If you are going to a two filter setup do you need to retain the Luberfiner for other than looks? The engine was not built with a bypass type filter so it may not be necessary.

    I like the looks of them myself when they are not all rusty and would leave the cannister in place for cosmetics.

    Rob

    Your correct, I don't really need the old canister type. This all started out when I was told there wouldn't be any clearance for the screw on oil filters ( only have two ) due to the close location of the steering colum in a B-75 once the engine was set in place. So that's why I thought just use the existing full flow /by-pass currently being used on my Endt673C 250 h.p. motor. I was told both a 676 and a 673C engines were a full flow/by-pass system??

    #7 OFFLINE   Rob

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    Posted 26 December 2009 - 06:20 PM

    Your correct, I don't really need the old canister type. This all started out when I was told there wouldn't be any clearance for the screw on oil filters ( only have two ) due to the close location of the steering colum in a B-75 once the engine was set in place. So that's why I thought just use the existing full flow /by-pass currently being used on my Endt673C 250 h.p. motor. I was told both a 676 and a 673C engines were a full flow/by-pass system??


    On the 676 series of engines the three filter setup was referred to "ESI" or "Extended Service Interval". The oil pan installed onto these engines were typically much larger in capacity, (like 60 quarts as opposed to 34) also. The two filter setup did not use the partial bypass filter as mentioned earlier. I've seen people leave the bypass type filters in place minus the element for larger oil capacity.

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    #8 OFFLINE   theakerstwo

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    Posted 26 December 2009 - 09:55 PM

    Sounds to me like he's not talking about a luberfiner, but a full flow/bypass Mack filter, also known as the "duplex clarifier", that would have the large oil lines running to it.



    I've seen those occasionally mounted remotely on the outside of the truck, usually on the frame rail just behind the cab.

    You are right that is not a luberfiner but a full flow by/pass.Two different lub system and engines.
    glenn akers

    #9 OFFLINE   Rob

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    Posted 26 December 2009 - 10:10 PM

    You are right that is not a luberfiner but a full flow by/pass.Two different lub system and engines.



    I am under the impression that Luberfiner manufactured both types of filters/housings used by Mack and have referred to both as Luberfiners. I do know the difference between the 500, and 750 series as I have both. My 64 B61 actually has "Luberfiner" on it and is the "clarifier" type, but I don't remember if it is stamped, or a tag. Both this truck, and my B67 utilize the same filters and have the two large hoses, and small hose in the bottom for oil routing.

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    #10 OFFLINE   b61mack

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    Posted 27 December 2009 - 05:10 AM

    On the 676 series of engines the three filter setup was referred to "ESI" or "Extended Service Interval". The oil pan installed onto these engines were typically much larger in capacity, (like 60 quarts as opposed to 34) also. The two filter setup did not use the partial bypass filter as mentioned earlier. I've seen people leave the bypass type filters in place minus the element for larger oil capacity.

    The "ESI" had two filters 32 quarts, "ESI PLUS" had 3 filters, 54 quarts. i think the old engines were 28 quarts.

    #11 OFFLINE   HK Trucking

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    Posted 27 December 2009 - 05:37 AM

    I have not ever put an engine with spin on filters in a B75,however,if I was doing the job, I'd "test fit" the engine in the truck and see exactly what the deal is with filters vs. steering shaft.

    Then you can see just what needs to be done, if anything, without resorting to speculation.
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    #12 OFFLINE   Rob

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    Posted 27 December 2009 - 09:16 AM

    The "ESI" had two filters 32 quarts, "ESI PLUS" had 3 filters, 54 quarts. i think the old engines were 28 quarts.


    That's right. I'd forgotten about the "Plus" designation but I've never had one.

    I'll have to look at my E6-350 as I don't remember for sure but seems like it has three filters.

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    #13 OFFLINE   workingbmodels

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    Posted 28 December 2009 - 08:11 PM

    So tell me...Has any reader ever installed an Endt 676 series charged air 2 valve engine in a B-75 truck? And if so let me know what I may be up agianst. Thanks! Marc

    #14 OFFLINE   theakerstwo

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    Posted 29 December 2009 - 08:35 PM

    I dont think that the two oil filter set up is going to be a problem with the steering. Just guessing
    glenn akers

    #15 ONLINE   dockmen027

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    Posted 29 December 2009 - 08:39 PM

    This is the setup on my friends B-75, even though he and another person in the know, say that the two and three filter system will fit. They also say it will be tight. This is the "duplex" canister and the plate on the block is one of the two pictures from the book.

    The bigger problem is the 676's fan is higher and doesn't fit in the origional 711 fan shroud on the B-75. My friend put the water pump from the 711 on the 676 to make it fit.


    Posted Image


    Posted Image

    #16 OFFLINE   theakerstwo

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    Posted 29 December 2009 - 09:02 PM

    Be very carefully when you start to mix the pressure regulator blocks and gaskets.There is many different gaskets that can be put under the block but only one proper one. i say many but maybe 4 dofferent gaskets for different blocks thru the years. If i took a filter set up from one emgine and installed it on another i would use the block that goes with that filter if it looks any different.
    glenn akers

    #17 OFFLINE   workingbmodels

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    Posted 29 December 2009 - 09:34 PM

    This is the setup on my friends B-75, even though he and another person in the know, say that the two and three filter system will fit. They also say it will be tight. This is the "duplex" canister and the plate on the block is one of the two pictures from the book.

    The bigger problem is the 676's fan is higher and doesn't fit in the origional 711 fan shroud on the B-75. My friend put the water pump from the 711 on the 676 to make it fit.


    Posted Image


    Posted Image

    Thanks for your response! So the blue truck pictured with the chrome filter housing has the 676 engine in it? And your saying it also is using that filter arrangement with the plate on the block corresponding with that filter arrangement? Also do you know the amount of oil pressure that 676 is running at? I've been questioned as to weather or not that old filter arrangement can handle the increased oil pressure from 60lbs. in a 673 to perhaps as much as 90lbs in a 676 engine. Thank agian for all your help!!

    #18 OFFLINE   workingbmodels

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    Posted 29 December 2009 - 09:46 PM

    Be very carefully when you start to mix the pressure regulator blocks and gaskets.There is many different gaskets that can be put under the block but only one proper one. i say many but maybe 4 dofferent gaskets for different blocks thru the years. If i took a filter set up from one emgine and installed it on another i would use the block that goes with that filter if it looks any different.

    Thanks agian for your help!!! Your absoultly right about being carefull! I to have been told to make sure I us the same block and gasket configuration to make sure oil is running as needed. If I were to use my 676 engine and replace it with my 673 engine do you feel it would work if I used the block and gasket arangement from the 673 I'm replacing? Of course I would match up the gasket with a new one at time if installation. Would the increased oil pressure from a 676 be to much for the older style filter arrangement? Also I'll just let you know I have the filter arrangement same as the one pictured on that partial blue truck picture. Look forward to your thoughts on this! Maybe we could chat over the phone sometime? Your in-put is greatly appreciated!! Marc

    #19 ONLINE   dockmen027

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    Posted 29 December 2009 - 10:02 PM

    Thanks for your response! So the blue truck pictured with the chrome filter housing has the 676 engine in it? And your saying it also is using that filter arrangement with the plate on the block corresponding with that filter arrangement? Also do you know the amount of oil pressure that 676 is running at? I've been questioned as to weather or not that old filter arrangement can handle the increased oil pressure from 60lbs. in a 673 to perhaps as much as 90lbs in a 676 engine. Thank agian for all your help!!


    Two more photos, hope they help. I can relay the question, but unfortunately, these two guys "in the know" would rather break a 10.00X20 tire than to be on a computer...

    The setup works just fine, pulling a 16,000 lb. camper for years.

    Posted Image
    (click to enlarge)
    Posted Image

    #20 OFFLINE   workingbmodels

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    Posted 29 December 2009 - 10:12 PM

    Two more photos, hope they help. I can relay the question, but unfortunately, these two guys "in the know" would rather break a 10.00X20 tire than to be on a computer...

    The setup works just fine, pulling a 16,000 lb. camper for years.

    Posted Image
    (click to enlarge)
    Posted Image

    Thanks agian for all the help!!! Is what I see a 676 engine with the older style filter arrangement like the one in your photo of the blue truck?? That's the same filter I'm currently using on my 673.So if I use the same block plate and gasket from the 673 and bolt it up to the 676 it should work? Will the greater oil pressure from the 676 be harmfull to the old filter? Marc




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